Парнишку никто не знает в лицо, а его имени не найти в Википедии. Но что же нам всё-таки о нём известно? Да только то, что он сам рассказывает. Короче говоря, наш сегодняшний герой та ещё загадка. Но что-то подсказывает, что в этом году мир займётся её разгадыванием, ну а сам Парнишка же тем временем продолжит залетать в различные музыкальные чарты и звучать в наушниках миллионов девчонок. Мы, конечно, могли бы попытаться его раскусить, но решили, что в этот раз просто мило пообщаемся. И вот представляем вашему вниманию Парнишку, размышляющего о разном.
Вот и Парнишка собственной персоной Фото: инстаграм Парнишки
Говорят, ты из Петербурга. А значит, не понаслышке знаешь о суровом и в то же время многогранном характере этого города. Но интересно, влияет ли он как-нибудь на твоё творческое настроение?
Да, я живу в Петербурге почти 15 лет. Наверное, этот город научил меня тоньше чувствовать оттенки грусти, меланхолии. В какой-то степени даже наслаждаться этими эмоциями, погружаться в них, как в медитацию. Как в хатха-йоге — ощущение приятной боли в мышцах)
А что касается жанра твоей музыки, как будет его точнее определять?
Ну, Парнишка как проект целиком сфокусирован на массовой поп-музыке без каких-либо приставок. Но при этом она не конформная, не подстраивается под местные тренды, а предлагает своё видение, свою версию поп-музыки. Это такой романтический подход.
Ну, раз заговорили о романтике, то хочется узнать кое-что и на эту тему. У одной твоей песни любопытное название —«Письма без любви». А ты сможешь вспомнить момент, когда сам в последний раз писал кому-нибудь настоящие бумажные письма?
Ещё до эпохи соцсетей была бумажная переписка с девушкой из другого города. Исписанные листки бумаги от другого человека вызывают во мне какой-то приятный трепет. Ведь ты понимаешь, что ради тебя она села вечером за письменный стол, сформулировала свои мысли, старательно написала их на бумаге, сложила в конверт, отнесла на почту…
Фото: инстаграм Парнишки
Какие-то искренние действия, проделанные ради тебя, — это всегда приятно.
Судя по всему ты ценишь искренность. Удаётся самому быть таким с миром?
Сокрытие лица — это минус тысяча очков к искренности в общении между артистом и аудиторией. Её нужно чем-то компенсировать. Песнями, разговорами о сокровенном. Я придумал как это сделать по-своему. Одним из таких способов компенсации стали войсы с мамой. Им веришь, потому что они, действительно, часть моей жизни, я на самом деле ежедневно созваниваюсь с мамой)
И вообще, для меня коммуникация со слушателями — очень важная часть работы над проектом. Я буду стараться заниматься этим всегда, на любом уровне популярности в силу своих возможностей. Но, разумеется, я готов поддерживать интеллектуальный содержательный диалог, а не флуд.
Ты уже не раз рассказывал о том, почему решил стать анонимным-артистом. Но вот что насчёт будущего раскрытия этой тайны? Придумал ли ты уже уникальный способ, как однажды сделаешь это?
Есть несколько вариантов, но если честно, пока максимально комфортно себя чувствую в роли анонима)
Вселенная должна подкинуть ситуацию, после которой я пойму, что пришло время снять маски.
Фото: инстаграм Парнишки
Ладно, с будущим немного повременим, не станем портить интригу. Зато мы можем с лёгкостью откатиться в прошлое. Расскажешь, сколько лет у тебя ушло на то, чтобы вывести своё творчество с уровня «слушают все друзья и родственники» на «крутят по радио»?
Больше десяти. Причём этому поспособствовало не только пресловутое правило 10000 часов, технический прогресс, а какой-то комплексный жизненный опыт. Насмотренность, наслушанность, работа над собой, своими временем, желаниями, да даже над питанием. Мне в какой-то момент врачи посоветовали ограничить глютен в рационе, и через полгода вообще по-другому голова стала варить. Как будто запотевшее стекло протёр тряпочкой.
А был ли какой-то один определённый момент, когда ты осознал, что в дверь постучался успех?
Наверное, нет. Я настолько занят и увлечён работой, что не слышу посторонних стуков. В наушниках сижу, новый трек пишу)
Абсолютно в каждом твоём интервью можно прочитать, что ты тащишься по музыке 90-х и 00-х. Но на что именно ты вдохновляешься ей?
Наверное, просто в российской музыке 90-х и 00-х я чаще встречаю осмысленность и содержательность — и текста, и мелодии, и аранжировки. В современной поп-музыке очень редко такое встречается — чтобы во всех трёх аспектах эта содержательность присутствовала. Навскидку только Монеточку могу назвать. Луну, ну ещё пару-тройку имён.
Фото: инстаграм Парнишки
Возможно, это связано с тем, что сейчас все мы находимся в едином информационном поле. Нет возможности обособленного, герметичного развития без оглядки на нормы, тренды, правила. А в 90-х каждый сам в своём собственном микромире, на своём островке в океане эти правила и нормы для себя определял и думал своей головой. В этом причина музыкального разнообразия. Существования поп-музыки с авторским мышлением. Смерть автора в современном искусстве во многом произошла из-за атрофии этой самобытности. Мы разучились развивать в себе авторов из-за постоянной, такой соблазнительной, возможности скатать всё у соседа.
Уже придумал, с кем бы хотел заколлабиться следующим?
Монеточка, Zivert, Антоха МС, Иван Дорн, Моя Мишель, Limba, Дора, СБПЧ… Недавно открыл для себя прекрасную артистку Маяк. Хочу предложить ей спеть вместе. Мне кажется, у меня есть хорошая песня для нашего фита ☺️
Кстати, что думаешь о набирающем темпы явлении среди русскоязычных исполнителей уходить в английский сонграйтинг? Парнишка запоёт однажды на другом языке?
Точно нет, я славянофил. Считаю, что рождать культурно значимые смыслы возможно только на родном языке. Бывают исключения, но они редки. Это как на даче под Питером выращивать мандарины. Наверное, если постараться, что-то да вырастет, но в субтропиках как-то с этим попроще будет.
Как думаешь, окажется ли способен кто-то из фанатов однажды разгадать твой секрет?
Конечно, и кто-то уже разгадал. Но, к счастью, они тактично оставляют это в тайне, чтобы не навредить проекту. За что я им благодарен. А вообще, у меня нет какого-то маниакального желания скрываться. Если для того же Бэнкси это принципиальный момент, часть игры, то для меня это возможность разъединить персонажа и его автора. Мы схожи, но существенные различия между Парнишкой и его создателем всё же есть.
Фото: инстаграм Парнишки
И чем же они различаются?
Один придуман, другой реален, но я пока не понял, кто есть кто)
Хитрый ход. Может тогда хотя бы расскажешь, какие у тебя есть стремления в отношении твоей виртуальной карьеры? Может ты бы хотел устроить масштабный цифровой концерт, как The Weekend в Тик Токе?
Да, хочется поступательно развивать карьеру и с каждым шагом получать больше возможностей для реализации своих задумок. Кстати, мне скорее тут интересно поработать с воплощением идеи виртуальности на живом концерте, а не в формате трансляции. Меня очень впечатлила серия документального сериала Abstract о современном дизайне. Эпизод был посвящён английской художнице и сценографу Эс Девлин, которая работала над оформлением концертов Бейонсе, Канье, U2, Адель. Она гений, это какой-то запредельный уровень визуального мышления. Настоящее, большое искусство. Хотелось бы хотя бы маленькими шажочками двигаться в этом направлении.
Ну, пока Эс Девлинпривлечена к другим проектам, давай расскажем о тех, кто сегодня занимается разработкой стиля Парнишки. Визуальное содержание инстаграмма, арты к синглам, тематика образа в целом. Кто стоит за всем этим?
Концепцию я создаю сам, но визуальный стиль мы разрабатываем вместе, обсуждая с командой. Базовые цвета, стилистику фотосессии для каждого конкретного сингла. Иногда привлекаем специалистов — аниматоров, фотографов, видеографов. Например, проморолики для песни «Зая» и анимацию для клипа делала очень талантливая художница-аниматорка Кристина Алмиева. Надеюсь, ещё поработаем с ней над будущими релизами.
Фото: инстаграм Парнишки
Изначально концепт выстраивался исходя из наших возможностей, а точнее из их отсутствия. Кажется, у режиссёров Козинцева и Трауберга была коронная фраза «доведение дефекта до эффекта». Когда ты вынужденно записываешь песни на плохую аппаратуру, но в итоге делаешь эту грязь стилеобразующим приёмом. Так и у нас базовые навыки работы с графическими редакторами, прогами для 3D-дизайна и монтажа вылились в какую-то симпатичную историю.
А кто тебе помогает с производством музыки?
Мне повезло, что я с детства дружу с Димой Орловым. Помимо того, что он человек хороший, он ещё и супер звукорежиссёр, прямо топовый. И доведением песен до профессионального звучания занимается именно он. Если бы его не было в команде, Парнишка бы таких результатов не добился, это совершенно точно.
Ну, и на последок, расскажи о главном — о чём ты мечтаешь?
В музыке — написать по-настоящему народную песню, чтобы она осталась в коллективной памяти всерьёз и надолго. Как «Конь» у Игоря Матвиенко. А в жизни — пожить подольше, чтобы эту песню успеть написать.
Очарование нашего сегодняшнего героя не сможет скрыть ни одна маска. Заинтриговать – заинтригует, но уж точно не обманет. Если попытаться ещё немного передать впечатление, которое складывается о ней при знакомстве, можно добавить – обаятельная девушка-загадка. Не менее притягательны и её работы, что клип Мальбэка и Сюзанны «Тайна», что «Губы» Доса. Концепции, истории, кадры, движения – их нужно смотреть внимательно, медленно, вдумчиво. В каждом проекте чувствуется вложенная душа автора, но ведь иначе и быть не может, когда творишь с любовью и любя. Как мы поняли, таков главный принцип Пелагеи Зайцевой, но давайте позволим ей самой нам об этом рассказать.
Всё это, постепенно переплетаясь, приходило в мою жизнь. В какой-то момент люди, случаи и время – всё сошлось, и я сказала этому «да».
Пелагея Зайцева
При знакомстве с любой историей всегда очень интересно открыть завесу тайны её зарождения. Расскажешь, с чего начался твой творческий путь?
Всё началось с танца. Закончив школу, я поступила в институт на хореографа балетмейстера. На тот момент эта специальность привлекала меня безумно сильно. Если коротко, то это своего рода сценический режиссёр: он не просто ставит хореографию, а создаёт весь концепт постановки. Тогда же в институте я начала снимать видео собственных танцев. Меня вдохновляла идея того, что можно запечатлеть красивый момент и сохранить его таким навсегда. Во мне горели амбиции, нуждавшиеся в реализации. Но всё время я сталкивалась с одной проблемой: находять по ту сторону камеры, ты теряешь способность контролировать происходящее в моменте. А ведь всё это такое хрупкое. Меня сильно расстраивало, что я не могла ухватить эти мгновения. Каждый раз я хотела делать лучше, но для этого мне было нужно что-то изменить.
И вот однажды этот момент настал. Для дипломной работы было необходимо придумать свой собственный балет, расписав его до мелочей. И тогда, неожиданно, мой молодой человек предложил снять мою постановку – запечатлеть её в видео историю. Эта идея мне так понравилась. Думаю, то были мои первые большие съёмки. Мы сильно заморочились, долго готовились и трудились над проектом. Вот тогда, кажется, я и влюбилась в этот процесс. В тот момент я почувствовала, как из ничего, просто из моей фантазии, на моих глазах рождалось что-то новое, обрастающее формой и собственной жизнью. Меня так впечатлило это прекрасное.
Но как же ты оказалась в кинематографе, если училась работать с искусством именно театра?
Это произошло не сразу. После защиты диплома я попала на практику в театр, где помогала режиссёру, занималась хореографией, танцевала сама и преподавала. Считаю, что именно эта непрерывная работа с людьми и пространством стала для меня очень важным опытом, оказавшимся в последствии основой моего внутреннего режиссёра. Я переняла столько всего из хореографии. И вот благодаря тому, что я занималась театральной режиссурой, а мой молодой человек, Анатолий Трофимов, был связан с операторским делом, я всегда так или иначе была рядом с киноиндустрией. Я заезжала на съёмочные площадки, общалась с разными творческими людьми из этой сферы, наблюдала за работой департаментов, помогала друзьям с их проектами. В самом начале я с гордостью крутила фокус. И вот всё это потихоньку меня влюбляло и затягивало в кино.
Я и не заметила, как всё пришло к тому, что во время нашего путешествия по Америке я сняла свой первый клип. Одни наши хорошие знакомые-музыканты предложили послушать их новый альбом, спросили о впечатлениях и поинтересовались, не хотим ли мы попробовать снять для них что-нибудь на понравившуюся песню. Весь выбор был за мной. И я, конечно же, с безумным удовольствием согласилась. Придумать свою собственную историю, ещё и снять её за рубежом – однозначно, я этого хотела и не могла упустить такую возможность. Так и получился мой первый клип. И был он для Ромы Мальбэка и Сюзанны.
Это, правда, удивительная история
После этого я поняла, что я хочу делать в жизни.
Звучит так вдохновляюще. А что теперь? Может ты планируешь пойти учиться профессионально на режиссёра?
Мой внутренний самозванец, конечно, постоянно заставляет меня сомневаться в моей компетентности и думать о получении профильного образования. Я много общаюсь с ребятами, которые уже отучились или ещё учатся, узнаю у них подробнее об этом. Я абсолютно согласна, что люди не просто так учатся по пять лет. Факультет режиссуры способен дать многое. Но я также считаю, что важна грамотность тех знаний, которыми наделяют людей в институтах. Я встречала примеры ребят, уникальность и индивидуальность которых пытались сгладить и подстроить под старые уклады российского образования, что не может не огорчает. Из-за этого ведь и теряется вся магия. Однако я вижу недостатки и в отсутствии профильного обучения, хоть порой прекрасными режиссёрами становятся те, кто получали абсолютно другие специальности.
Про себя я поняла, что могу учиться по-разному. Когда мне не хватает знаний, я беру и иду искать их в различных источниках. Это может быть интересный курс, организованная лекция или просто книга. Сейчас чем больше я варюсь во всём этом, тем больше понимаю, что потребность обучаться во мне не иссякает. Я снова и снова тянуть за новым, неизвестным. Но мои учителя – это сами люди и съёмочная площадка. Именно в этом взаимодействии я и нахожу для себя главную ценность обучения.
Клип Полины Зайцевой на «Lorn&Dolor The woods»; автор постеров – Анастасия Бармакова
Из рассказа можно сделать вывод, что твоя история была бы невозможна без танцев. А какое место хореография занимает в твоей жизни сегодня?
Был период, когда я загорелась режиссурой и решила отказаться от танцев совсем. Я очень долго не смотрела в эту сторону, хотя за спиной был бэкграунд в 12-13 лет профессиональных занятий. Но в тот момент мне захотелось полностью перестроиться, научиться смотреть на себя, на профессию и на мир по-новому. Я отчаянно захотела научиться думать по-другому, не так, как меня всю жизнь учили. Не знаю, хорошо это или плохо, но такой перерыв в танцах произошёл.
Потом постепенно ко мне начало приходить осознание того, что как бы я ни старалась отказаться от хореографии, но именно в этом и есть я. Я никуда не денусь от такой значимой части своего прошлого, все эти знания – во мне, в моём теле. И на самом деле всё это – большая ценность. Эта часть и составляет мою индивидуальность, в том числе и как режиссёра. Лишь со временем я научилась этим пользоваться, и это было правильным решением. Ведь люди как книги: дописывая новые главы, мы волей не волей возвращаемся к уже имеющимся в нас знаниям. Они хранятся внутри нас и никуда не деваются. За нами лишь остаётся задача научиться ими правильно распоряжаться.
Всё то, что было взято мной из хореографии, воплотилось в моём творчестве. И я не забываю про это, хоть теперь и хочу пробовать себя в другом, расширяя горизонты.
Вот с недавних пор я начала постепенно возвращать движение в свою жизнь, потому что, как уже было сказано ранее, без хореографии я не могу быть собой. Когда я смотрю какие-то постановки, импровизационные движения человека, я будто нахожусь под гипнозом. Меня так восхищает человеческое тело и то, как оно способно двигаться в пространстве. Очень долгое время я шла к тому, чтобы понять, что мне хочется отдать, своего рода, почтение искусству танца и моей любви к нему с помощью кино.
А как ты поняла, какая форма видео историй тебе ближе?
Поскольку я начинала изучать всё это самостоятельно, то в какой-то момент мне было особенно важно найти своё направление. Я начала этот поиск, просто пробуя разные формы и стили. Для меня самым первым понятным форматом стали именно клипы. Я по своей сущности, конечно, большой визуал. Мне нравится переносить людей в другой мир за счёт атмосферы. Я много работаю над передачей ощущений через образы. Только продумав образ, я могу структурировать всё дальнейшее.
После того, как я попробовала клипы, мне захотелось познакомиться и с другими формами. Так родился короткий метр «ANA». Вот только с рекламой я всё ещё не смогла сработаться. Я понимаю, что в мире коммерции есть свои особые правила и законы, среди которых нужно просто жить, не пытаясь сопротивляться и менять их. Однако это принятие во мне пока ещё лишь проходит процесс трансформации. Я не люблю ограничивать себя рамками, в рекламе же ты идёшь на это осознанно. А мне этого как будто бы мало, я словно не помещаюсь в этот формат. Поэтому сегодня в основном я работаю больше на визуальных историях, продолжая искать свой идеальный формат. Мне нравится сотрудничать с отдельными брендами, для которых через свою интерпретацию, видение и фантазии я могу придумывать образы и концепции. А что касается больших историй, я пробовала поработать и с ними немного, но поняла, что вот именно для них мне пока что не хватает опыта и мастерства.
Расскажешь ещё какую-нибудь увлекательную историю со съёмок? Что-то подсказывает, что история создания клипа на «Lorn&Dolor The woods»окажется именно такой.
Ой, это очень необычная и, на самом деле, долгая история, зародившаяся во время простой прогулки по моему району, рядом с которым проходила огромная автомагистраль. На тот момент она была только отстроена, и под мостом было столько впечатляющего пустого пространства. Оно выглядело абсолютно нереально: над тобой возвышается огромный бетонный дракон, вокруг колонны, поезда, эхо, голова идёт кругом. Тогда, в долгих творческих разговорах и родилась история о ребёнке, существующем в подобном бетонном, разрушенном, каком-то постапокалиптическом мире, где есть свои особые законы. Эта идея поселилась в голове Толи, очень долго не отпускала его, и вот как-то раз он сел и впервые в жизни написал подробный структурированный сценарий. А затем предложил мне снять по нему фильм, убежденный, что кроме меня эту идею никто не сможет так раскрыть. Я считаю, что эти слова, конечно же, были отчасти лестью, но мне понравилось его предложение, и мы стали жить с этой задумкой, постоянно обсуждая и разрабатывая её.
Бэкстейдж со съёмок «Lorn&Dolor The woods»
Мы долго думали о месте съёмок, пытаясь найти то самое, что окажется способно передать атмосферу всей истории, всю её постапокалиптическую разруху. Мы не видели такой Москву, хотя и здесь есть много классных локаций. Не помню как, но мы пришли к тому, что нужно ехать снимать в Киев. Написали нашим хорошим знакомым Паше и Кате из Rafesthetic и рассказали о своей истории. Ребята нас пытались отговаривать, но мы были настроены серьёзно. Взяли деньги, камеру, плёнку, сели в машину и поехали. Было и страшно, и сложно отправляться в эту поездку. В действительности вся дорога прошла легко, и мы добрались туда без приключений. Когда начался процесс подготовки к съёмкам, мы поняли, что единственные, кто прям горит этим проектом, – это только мы сами. Это осознание, конечно, сильно нас расстроило.
Мы не понимали, что делать дальше, но знали одно – брать и возвращаться домой, так ничего и не сняв, это не наш вариант. Ни я, ни Толя не были готовы делать шаг назад, и поэтому решили закончить проект, как бы там ни было. Мы знали, что есть друг у друга, а этого нам достаточно. Всё остальное всегда найдётся по ходу. Конечно, кто-то из ребят отваливался от проекта, но также приходили и новые, и по итогу организовались четыре съёмочных дня. Это были колоссальнейшие съёмки, первые в моей жизни такие масштабные и сложные. До этого всегда были проекты из серии два человека, неспешная история, лайф-стайл обстановка, в которой ты можешь додумывать что-то красивое и нежное на ходу. А в Киеве был уровень просто хардкор. Мы ходили по заброшкам и свалкам металлолома в поисках идеальной локации, устраивали кастинг через специального агентство для поиска главного героя. С мальчиком нам, кстати, очень повезло. Он просто космический. Правда, стоит отметить, что работа с детьми – это, конечно, совсем другой уровень, это педагогика в высшей форме мастерства. Объяснить юному парню серьёзные сценические вещи через понятные ощущения и эмоции – тоже надо суметь.
Бэкстейдж со съёмок «Lorn&Dolor The woods»
И вот все эти дни мчались в нон-стоп режиме. С каждым новым – трудностей становилось всё больше и больше. Особенно безумно прошли съёмки группы ребят, омона, пиротехники, они стали реальной проверкой нас на прочность. Всем было тяжело эмоционально. Но мы понимали, что сдаваться нельзя. Хочется ещё раз сказать, что это стало возможно лишь благодаря всей команде, которая поддерживала нас и шла вместе с нами до конца. Я им так благодарна. После того, как мы отсняли этот материал нам потребовалось минимум полгода на восстановление. Проявив плёнку, сидя перед компьютером, я понимала, что у меня нет сил что-то делать с исходниками. Перед глазами буквально вспыхивали флэшбэки всех трудностей, что нам пришлось тогда преодолеть. Сделав минимальный монтаж, я с болью поняла, что изначально задумавшийся короткий метр не получается. И в тот момент я просто спрятала материал в долгий ящик.
Кадры из клипа «Lorn&Dolor The woods»
Однако все полгода я не могла выкинуть из головы проект, в который было вложено столько труда, я понимала, что он должен был быть доделан. И тогда мы с Толей стали мозговать и решили связаться с каким-нибудь продакшеном. Встретились с Вовой из Jetlaga и показали ему материал. Ему он понравился, и ребята взяли его в работу. Мне сразу стало так спокойно и хорошо на душе. Вся боль куда-то испарилась. Я смогла признать себе, что мы сняли крутой материал, и поверила в его будущее. Тогда запустился постпродакшен. Мы приняли решение переработать всю концепцию, чтобы вновь уместить проект в рамки музыкального видео. Всем известно, то где-то 80% успеха клипа заключается, конечно же, в его музыке. Перед нами стояла сложная задача – надо было найти подходящего музыкального артиста под уже отснятый материал. Вариантов было много. Ребята из Jetlaga предложили Лорну наш материал, и он согласился. Мне так понравилось то, как всё сложилось по итогу. Вот этот способ работы – снять то, что ты хочешь, и продать готовый продукт музыканту – так меня восхитил. Я, конечно, считаю, что без этой потрясающей музыки и не менее мастерского монтажа проект бы не вышел таким успешным. После того, как мы всё склеили, никто не узнал в нём то, что было на исходниках. Вот так это работает. Ты можешь слепить из своего материала столько всего разного.
Кадры из клипа «Lorn&Dolor The woods»
Чему тебя научил этот впечатляющий опыт?
Главное, что я осознала из всей этой истории, – всё то, что в нашей голове выглядит как неосуществимое, как то, что не может работать иным нежели привычным образом, всё это – на самом деле возможно. По сути, возможно всё, важно лишь верить в свою идею. А люди, готовые довериться тебе, всегда найдутся. Это 100% работает.
А нравится ли тебе писать сценарии к своим проектам?
Пишу я сама понемногу. Обычно это просто идеи, неожиданно приходящие ко мне в голову. Я не могу не записывать их, ведь они могут испариться и никогда не вернуться. Мне также удалось придумать рабочую историю, схему, в которой мне сейчас максимально комфортно творчески существовать. Она проста и заключается в том, чтобы создать уникальную среду, где находятся индивидуальные личности, каждая из которых делает то, что у неё лучше всего получается. Все они при взаимодействии со мной, как с режиссёром, могут поделиться своим видением и идеями. Я всегда стремлюсь черпать от людей разные точки зрения, присматриваться к тому, что они могут найти в той или иной истории благодаря своему собственному опыту. Я абсолютно «за» командную работу, считаю, что именно в этом заключён ключ к успеху. Коллаборации людей приводят к тому, что в процессе объединения разных знаний собирается тот самый заветный пазл.
Есть ли у тебя какая-нибудь конкретная мечта, которую хотелось бы воплотить в режиссуре? Например, снять проект в Голливуде.
Странно, но прям так сразу ничего в голову и не приходит, да и говорить о великих фильмах в Голливуде мне не хочется. Думаю, я всегда была одним из продвиженцев идеи делать то, что может как-то помочь людям или затронуть что-то очень важное! С помощью своих работ мне хочется подталкивать людей на то, чтобы они всё больше открывали глаза на происходящее вокруг них. Я мечтаю создавать то, что способно пробуждать сердца и показывать над чем можно задуматься. А каким уже методом лучше всего делать это, кто знает, я же – не перестаю искать свой.
Как сегодня ты себя самоощущаешь в творчестве?
Чем больше я занимаюсь режиссурой и общаюсь с творческими людьми, тем отчётливее понимаю, что я тянусь к разному. Я – и про визуальные истории, и про живые эмоции и чувства, и про важные серьёзные вещи, которые резонируют со многими, которые способны кому-то даже помочь. Я – фанат людей и жизни. Живые истории – моё вдохновение и любовь.
Сейчас я пришла к тому, что при работе с видео мне не хватает глубины в передаче ощущений зрителю. Хочется показывать человеку историю не только визуально, но и, например, тактильно, и так, чтобы он видел пространство, а вокруг него воздух наполнялся запахом этого места и переносил его туда. Сегодня я нахожусь в поиске того способа, формата, который сможет воплотить в жизнь все мои идеи, все мои «хочу», которые пока не помещаются в формат видео.
Лучше всего об этих ребятах вам расскажет их музыка. Но на всякий случай мы решили поприставать к Павлу и Тарасу с вопросиками, и рады представить вашему вниманию немного инсайдерской информации о создателях главного хита этой зимы (речь про «Первый снег» сейчас идёт, если что) прямиком из первых уст. Наслаждайтесь.
Фото: официальное сообщество «Группа Сова» в вконтакте; в красной шапочке – Павел Штонденко, в чёрной – Тарас Овсянников 🙂
Расскажите немного поподробнее про биографию Совы. С чего начался ваш творческий путь?
Мы собрали группу примерно в конце 2013 года, когда стали учиться в университете. На тот момент это не было проектом с определёнными целями, нам нравилась музыка и хотелось прожить этот опыт. Мы получали удовольствие от того, что можно играть любимые песни составом из разных музыкантов. Тогда мы играли в основном не свои песни, а каверы на русскоязычных исполнителей, которые нравились плюс- минус всем участникам коллектива.
А как появилось название группы?
Мы стали нуждаться в названии для коллектива на одном из первых концертов. В течение некоторого времени мы рассматривали разные варианты, и достаточно быстро пришли к тому, что «Сова» на тот момент оптимально подходила под название. Но стоит отметить, что мы не рассматривали название как инвестицию на будущее и не думали о том, что это будет, по сути, нашим брендом на долгие годы.
К какому жанру стоит относить вашу музыку?
Сейчас мы позиционируем себя как пост-панк коллектив. Кажется, что это честнее всего отражает то, что происходит в нашей музыке сегодня. На самом деле, разброс по жанрам в наших релизах достаточно большой, мы заимствуем приёмы из разной музыки. Про некоторые песни можно сказать, что это прогрессив-рок, про другие – что это барокко-поп или инди-поп.
Фото: официальное сообщество «Группа Сова» в вконтакте
Ваша музыкальная история началасьв Екатеринбурге, но вот интересно, удалось ли вам уже сыграть на всех площадках родного города?
Честно говоря, мы никогда не ставили перед собой такую задачу, поэтому не можем похвастаться большим количеством площадок, где у нас проходили концерты. Хотя, их было и не мало. Правда, многих из них уже не существует, к сожалению. Например, у нас был сольник в баре F. Starter, который закрылся в течение нескольких месяцев после нашего концерта. Также мы играли в клубе Nirvana, в Доме Печати. Насчёт последнего заведения особенно обидно, эту площадку тоже закрыли.
Если ли у вас какая-то одна определённая цель в музыке? Или вы не думаете о финише, а только о самом пути?
Очень сложно определить одну цель, когда ты занимаешься творчеством. Достаточно много вещей зависит не от тебя, а от социального контекста: какую музыку люди готовы слушать сегодня, услышат ли они её вообще, даже если она теоретически может им понравиться. Также в разные периоды жизни и карьеры могут быть различные цели и задачи. Например, в самом начале ты хочешь, чтобы тебя просто кто-то услышал. Потом – чтобы тебя услышало больше людей. Когда ты начинаешь зарабатывать с музыки, тебе хочется, чтобы ты мог обеспечивать себя только этим. Продолжать можно долго, но суть ясна: время идёт, идеи рождаются вновь и вновь, сменяя друг друга.
Фото: официальное сообщество «Группа Сова» в вконтакте
При знакомстве с вашим творчеством возникает впечатление, что вы – этакие неизлечимые романтики. Так ли это в действительности?
Скорее всего, мы действительно романтичны в чём-то, но это трудно назвать нашей главной человеческой особенностью. Даже в занятии музыкой приходится во многих вещах быть прагматичными. Приятно бывает в рамках какой-то песни утрировать в себе эту черту, быть нарочито романтичным. Это ведь в определённом смысле игра. Игра со своими эмоциями, игра с эмоциями слушателя. Ты как будто бы создаёшь музыкальный фрагмент с определённым настроением, которое живо только в тот момент, когда песня звучит. А когда песня закончилась, ты идёшь платить за коммуналку и покупать в магазине батон, а это уже не так романтично.
А какая самая большая сложность есть для вас в процессе создания музыки?
Порой сложными оказываются некоторые рутинные моменты, вроде репетиций или сведения трека. Это такие вещи, которые нужно просто сделать, и не важно, принесёт это удовольствие или нет.
Фото: официальное сообщество «Группа Сова» в вконтакте
К слову об удовольствии, что вам способна дать музыка такого, чего не достаёт в жизни?
Музыка – это достаточно любопытная в социальном плане вещь. Музыкантов как будто бы принято уважать и ценить уже за то, что они музыканты. Но в то же время музыкант в социальных сетях – это такая подушка, в которую можно поплакать, или какой-то неодушевленный предмет, на который можно покричать. Музыкант в медиа пространстве перестаёт быть человеком для окружающих, поэтому можно столкнуться с очень разными проявлениями человеческого внимания. Наверное, внимание со стороны слушателей – это как раз то, с чем в обычной жизни столкнуться почти невозможно.
Приходится ли вам совмещать творчество с, например, учёбой или работой?
Да, мы работаем. Вообще, мы – графические дизайнеры, и в основном занимаемся этим, либо какими-то смежными с дизайном вещами. Наверное, мы бы могли жить и только на те деньги, которые приносит музыка, но сейчас нам это кажется сложной задачкой. Тем более, что иногда хочется переключаться на что-то другое.
Как вам кажется, начинающим музыкантам сложно пробиться к зрительскому вниманию?
Трудно оценить то, насколько было сложно сделать это раньше. Сейчас преград между слушателем и исполнителем всё меньше, но и выше конкуренция между самими музыкантами. Вероятно, сегодня – лучшее время в истории музыки для того, чтобы пробиться к зрительскому вниманию. Ты можешь стать звездой за один вечер, если песня очень удачно распространится в том же Тик Токе, например. Но, конечно, никаких гарантий не существует и в наше время.
К слову про «стать звездой за один вечер», ваш сингл «Первый снег» ведь стал именно таким случаем. Благодаря социальным сетям он получил так много внимания слушателей. Какова история написания этой песни, и ждали ли вы такой ответной реакции при релизе?
Песню мы сделали быстро, что нам не очень свойственно, честно говоря. Наверное, с момента, как появилась музыка, и до момента, когда песня уже имела текст и была полностью готова, прошло в районе пары недель.
Фото: официальное сообщество «Группа Сова» в вконтакте
У нас не было подобного опыта, поэтому мы не могли рассчитывать на то, что песню послушает так много людей. Более того, в данный момент непонятно, стоит ли ещё ждать подобной реакции на каких-то новых релизах, либо же данный опыт останется единственным.
А насколько важным для вас является положительное расположение слушателей к вашей музыке?
Конечно приятно создавать музыку, которая нравится тебе и которая откликается в зрителе тоже. Мы любим так много разных музыкальных жанров и стилей, поэтому нам не сложно раз за разом отыскивать точки соприкосновения со слушателем. Делать же всё время только то, что нравится тебе, зная, что слушатель это не принимает, достаточно странно, как нам кажется. В этом есть некий юношеский максимализм и нигилизм.
Как вы относитесь к коллаборациям в музыке? Хотели бы записать песню с какими-нибудь артистами?
Относимся положительно. На данный момент у нас есть уже, как минимум, 7 выпущенных совместных работ, например, со Свиданием или Сансарой. И конечно же, в планах имеются ещё некоторые коллаборации.
Чего ждать фанатам в скором будущем от Совы?
Очень скоро грядут новый альбом и тур. Перед этим будет ещё пара синглов.
Когда в мае 2021 года Тима ищет свет выпустил клип на свой тогдашний новый трек «Тост», внимание пользователей приковалось именно к музыкальной составляющей релиза. Это было заслуженно, спорить не станем. Но все же нельзя не отметить, что о визуале как-то позабыли, а ведь он способен впечатлить любого. Нам захотелось докопаться именно до этой части истории «Тоста». Как можно было ухитрится снять клип так, чтобы он идеально подходил под душу песни? Разобраться в этом нам сейчас поможет никто иной, как сам режиссёр, Миша Гасимов.
Миша Гасимов собственной персоной
Ну что, приоткроешь всем завесу тайны истории создания клипа «Тост»?
Слушай, все началось со встречи в баре с друзьями. Так получилось, что мы там встретили Лизу Громову. Она как раз и была в тот вечер с Тимой. Я знал его творчество и раньше, всегда считал, что Тима делает классную музыку и выделяется на сцене. Тогда мне нравился его старый альбом. И конечно я захотел пообщаться с ним лично, так мы с ним и познакомились. Я сразу же предложил ему поработать вместе, что-нибудь снять на уже готовую песню. Всегда круто, когда в одно время выходят и песня, и клип. Тима согласился. Сначала мы мозговали над идеей для одного проекта, но он выходил слишком затратным. К сожалению, иногда не удаётся воплощать задумки из-за нехватки финансовых возможностей. Какое-то время спустя со мной связался менеджер Тимы и предложил взяться за клип на новый трек из грядущего альбома. Мне дали послушать весь альбом, и я сразу же зацепился за «Тост». Я люблю, когда музыка содержит в себе такую темную, но в то же время мудрую атмосферу. Чем-то напомнило тот вайб, который в своё время создал Хаски. Я почувствовал вдохновение от трека и предложил ребятам снимать клип именно на него. Придумал концепт, расписал идею, презентовал команде. Мы помозговали, докрутили и пришли к финальному видению клипа. Я сразу же понял, что хочу показать через эту историю атмосферу неидеального мира. Я захотел потрогать эту форму, заглянуть туда.
Кадры из клипа «Тост»
Этот клип – калейдоскоп мрачных чувств: потерянность, бессмысленность, отчаяние. Почему ты захотел вложить в фундамент истории именно их, и как понял, каким образом с ними нужно обращаться?
Уже в самый первый раз, когда я слушал песню, я ярко почувствовал эту атмосферу. Музыка и слова отчётливо передают её, но в то же время они не показывают, что так – плохо. Всё это просто есть, и этот трек просто рассказывает об этом. Я бы даже сказал, что главное – в другом. Мне остро захотелось подбодрить тех, кто в жизни столкнулся с какими-то проблемами, кому не повезло в чём-то. «Слушай, не хворай» – вот истинный посыл. Это про поддержку. Я почувствовал её в песне Тимы, и мне захотелось дать её и другим.
А есть ли в клипе какие-нибудь моменты совпадения с твоей собственной жизнью?
Начнём с того, что живу я в Москве недавно, так я из города Электросталь. И вот там моё детство было чисто в духе пацанского движа. Я тусовался с друзьями по городу, исследовал жизнь. Я бы не сказал, что все показанные в клипе моменты созвучны со мной, но определённо общий вайб присутствует. Сложно ухватить какой-то один отдельный фрагмент в виде осязаемой формы, но можно передать общее настроение и атмосферу. Думаю, именно это через свою призму я и попытался сделать.
Кадры из клипа «Тост»
Интересно, а этот клип стал твоей первой серьёзной работой?
Мне доводилось и раньше работать с профессиональной командой, но в вопросе самостоятельной режиссуры музыкального клипа, пожалуй, да, именно «Тост» стал первым опытом знакомства с этой формой. Вокруг него собралась столько талантливых, заряженных ребят. Благодаря вкладу каждого мы получили то, что имеем. Этот проект, определённо, стал очень важным шагом в моём творчестве. Он расширил мой диапазон видения и мира в целом, и режиссуры.
После знакомства с форматом музыкальных клипов ты понял, что это твоё?
На данный момент я очень заинтересован в съёмке клипов, да. Хотелось бы поработать над теми проектами, музыка которых откликается во мне, созвучна с моей душой. Помимо этого поля деятельности, я, конечно же, не забываю и про рекламные проекты. Мне нравится реклама в вопросе креатива, подходов, визуального воздействия на зрителя. Если говорить про кино, то я очень хочу соприкоснуться и с этим миром. Но в полный метр я лезть пока не готов, это было бы как-то слишком смело. Чувствую, что надо сначала получше узнать короткий метр. Сейчас вот пробую писать свой сценарий, посмотрим, что получится.
То есть ты хочешь пока что работать только над своими собственными проектами?
Конечно, нет. Я всегда открыт к предложениям. Когда мне скидывают различные сценарии, я внимательно их изучаю. Каждый раз начинаю искать в них что-то, что было бы созвучно со мной. Но мне кажется, в коротком метре обязательно должен быть, скажем так, прикол, маленький, но содержащий в себе весь смысл этой истории. Ты смотришь, доходишь до этого момента и что-то осознаешь. Он может быть разной формы, разного вида. К сожалению, в сценариях, что мне уже доводилось читать, я редко находил этот прикол. Решил попробовать написать свой сценарий, стараясь сделать его мощным, но на простом языке. Хочу снять историю в одном помещении, чтобы всё было завязано не столько на смене локаций, сколько на взаимодействии героев в кадре.
Проект Миши Гасимова «Demon»
А насколько вообще труден путь начинающего режиссёра в этой индустрии?
Сегодня эта профессия стала довольно популярна, но она и, правда, очень интересная. Я сам пока что ещё лишь нащупываю её. Могу сказать точно, что мне, определённо, нравится работать с визуальной формой, хоть это часто и не просто. Ты сталкиваешься с проблемами разного типа, но когда тебе удаётся их преодолеть, ты понимаешь, что всё это привело к лучшему, ты пошел по иному пути, отклонился от первоначальной траектории, чтобы прийти к более качественному.
Мог бы посоветовать что-нибудь своим братьям по оружию?
Главное, что мне хочется напомнить, – всегда есть чему учиться. Если ты считаешь себя всезнающим и всёумеющим, ты остановился. Хочу посоветовать всем почаще чувствовать себя, скажем так, глупыми, дурачками и готовыми учиться новому. Будьте открыты к любому опыту. Полезнее делать хоть что-то, даже малое, чем не делать ничего. Даже если из этого не получится задуманного, ты поймёшь многое для себя, и дальше будет только лучше. Весь опыт приходит в процессе, помни.
Ты задал серьезный тон, что ж, давай продолжим в том же духе. Расскажи тогда, что по-твоему самое главное в режиссуре?
Я думаю, самое главное в этом деле – суметь поделиться тем, что ты чувствуешь и зажечь людей вокруг себя. Задача режиссёра сделать так, чтобы команда увидела ту картину мира, которая появилась у него в голове, а затем общими силами рассказать её, дополняя и усовершенствуя, остальным.
А как ты понял, что хочешь снимать кино?
Режиссура заманила меня тем, что, будучи в этом процессе, ты можешь из ничего создавать что-то. Я вижу это так: режиссёр задаёт форму, остальная команда лепит из неё волшебство. Но честно говоря, я стараюсь не ограничивать себя тем, что я только режиссёр. Конечно, каждый должен делать свою работу и делать её качественно, но мне помимо режиссуры нравится ещё многое другое: например, порой я хочу и с операторами повозиться над картинкой. Ведь я именно с этого и начинал когда-то. Камеры меня вдохновляют с самого детства. Я пробовал, снимал всякие проекты, работал с картинкой. Со временем заработал себе на первую качественную технику, начал снимать серьёзнее. Потом – удалось выйти на уровень, когда моё увлечение стало приносить какие-то первые деньги. Тогда я почувствовал, как же круто и снимать, и ещё и зарабатывать на этом.
Как считаешь, режиссёру необходимо образование?
Считаю, что образование нужно всем. Я, к сожалению, не учился нигде по профилю кино. Очень хотел бы, но пока что сложилось так. Мой режиссерский путь выстроился по личному опыту проб и ошибок, просмотру фильмов, изучению деятелей этого искусства. Я не стал себя ограничивать из-за того, что где-то не отучился. Я убеждён, что ты можешь учиться по-разному, в том числе и дома: читай книги, сценарии, разбирайся на примерах, прокачивайся. Образование – круто, но если ты чувствуешь, что тебя тянет, не нужно ждать, попробуй сам. Вдруг что-то да получится.
Давай теперь немного добавим лёгкости. Расскажи, откуда ты черпаешь вдохновение для своих проектов.
Ой, идеи повсюду. Они абсолютно везде: от просмотра каких-то роликов до бытовых вещей, вроде варки кофе. Я очень люблю лазить на vimeo, вдохновляясь и заряжаясь от других творческих ребят. Я стараюсь всматриваться, искать то, что меня цепляет, собирать это всё во что-то для себя. Часто ловлю себя на моментах, когда отмечаю, как мне понравился тот или иной приём какого-то художника. Я считаю абсолютно нормальным вдохновляться и стремиться перенять в своё творчество понравившееся. Заимствований не стоит бояться. Ты же всё равно используешь это открытие по-своему, изменишь его под себя, превратишь во что-то новое, интересное.
Проект Миши Гасимова «Benchionary»
Любому художнику хочется придумать свой авторский почерк, тот стиль, по которому его творчество будет узнавать мир. Что насчёт тебя, ты уже нашелсвой?
Я вообще не ограничиваю себя ни в форме, ни в стиле. Особенно в данный момент. Хоть я в жизни и позитивный человек так-то, мне, например, всё же было очень интересно потрогать мрачную часть нашего мира, его неидеальную сторону, эту сильную тьму. Не могу сказать точно, как всё пойдет дальше, остановлюсь ли я на этом стиле или нет. Сейчас я стараюсь пробовать разное, узнавать, что мне нравится, что ближе, с чем бы я хотел чаще соприкасаться. Комедии, шутки, свет – я и это обожаю.
Ну и на десерт, предлагаем помечтать немного. Расскажешь, есть ли у тебя какая-нибудь глобальная мечта в кинематографе?
Честно, у меня нет какой-то четкой финальной точки в мечтах. Я, конечно, хочу добиться результатов, направляясь в ту сторону, которая мне близка. Мне так грустно слышать, когда люди занимаются тем, что им не нравится. Я понимаю, бывают разные жизненные обстоятельства, но все равно как-то грустно за это. Мне повезло иметь то, что лежит к душе, к чему я искренне стремлюсь. Хочется двигаться дальше и делать больше. Если уж называть мечты, то снять собственный полный метр – это прям одна из них. Ещё хотелось бы поработать с зарубежными ребятами. Они такие крутые. Я смотрю на некоторых режиссёров и удивляюсь, как они все это делают. Это – другой мир.
We talked with Lee Foster (director) and Dave Poulin (producer) about their film ‘Black Bag’. It is meant to honour the men and women who sacrifice so much to keep the world safe, and at the same time offer a word of caution in regards to who we trust to make decisions and why.
The whole film is imbued with an atmosphere of tension and importance. But what secrets does this story keep? Will it be continued? And why is it important today to tell stories like this? — read in this interview.
Lee FosterDave Poulin
How did it come to your mind and what was your inspiration? Why exactly this idea?
Lee: Growing up I always enjoyed war movies and was drawn to military characters and scenarios. I’ve always been a big fan of Tom Clancy’s work, and upon reading Rainbow Six, and Mark Bowden’s Black Hawk Down (and seeing Ridley Scott’s movie) I was fascinated with the detail and aesthetic captured – and how throughout the reading and viewing experience I didn’t just get to experience these events but learn about the social, economic, and political influences of the times.
I do think that film is a special and unique form of art, because it allows so much information to be delivered to the recipient both consciously and subconsciously. We don’t just get to tell a story, we also get to paint a picture, and move our audience with our score. Film is this amazing amalgamation of wonderful talents and ideas, that when executed correctly can educate, inspire, and even change the way people view the world.
Lately we’ve seen a great deal of controversy and distrust towards the leaders and institutions that are supposed to represent and protect the interests of their people. We’ve seen officials in every level of governments around the world use their power for personal gain, abuse their status and manipulate their positions. Normalizing dishonesty and vapid morality in our leaders is a terrifying idea, and with infrastructures like the American Military Industrial Complex that take ‘national security’ and the armed forces and contort those ideas into “for-profit” enterprises, the opportunity for corruption and conflicts of interest seems inevitable.
People also seem to be generalizing more often – designating and judging entire demographics or careers. When power is being tested or asserted, it’s very rarely the guys making the calls that suffer the consequences – it’s normal people trying to make a living or trying to make a difference. I wanted to show this “black bag” operation from the ground level. We owe a huge debt to those who serve and have served – and we owe it to them to both remember the people behind the uniforms, and to carefully select who we elect to be the stewards of their lives.
If film has the potential to educate and change how people think, then I wanted to make a movie that challenges some of those growing societal norms that seem to be eating away at the bedrock of our communities. I wanted to tell a cautionary tale while also telling an exciting story in the same vein as the movies and books I love so much.
Dave: For myself, being a part of this short was a challenge and a lot of fun.
From a young age, I would consider myself a bit of a military enthusiast. My love for action movies and tactical video games grew and eventually introduced me to such games as Tom Clancy’s, Rainbow Six and Splinter Cell. The more I learned, the more I became fascinated. Movies like The Rock and Navy Seals eventually pushed me to want to experience even a small portion of that world, so I joined the Navy cadets in my teen years. Sadly, not being able to commit at such a young age, I got out of the cadets after 3 years but the appreciation never faded.
Many years later while working at a silly video rental store, I met my now best friend, Lee Foster. I learned very quickly we had a lot of the same interests when it came to movies and games and also learned that Lee was an aspiring filmmaker. He invited me to be a part of a small series concept he had and since then we’ve worked on several projects together. Over the years of growing closer and sharing our love of military style video games and action movies, we continued to share ideas. Leading us eventually to this project, Black bag.
This short has a larger vision behind it that actually pays homage to a few franchises such as Tom Clancy’s Rainbow six and Splinter cell and that is something that helped push us to come up with a story that could tie it all together. In today’s world, with everything going on in our government and military (especially in the United States) this just felt like the right time to touch on such subjects as uncertainty, doubt, fear and confusion towards the people pulling the strings in our government and military. The right time to remind us to have love, empathy, compassion and appreciation for the men and women that fight the battles on the front line.
What emotion did you want to evoke in the audience with your film?
Lee: I want people to leave the film sad, angry, and maybe thoughtful of the choices they make. In a world where people seem to vote reactively, I would hope that it would give viewers pause to consider the type of person they vote for, and the type of person they want in charge of the military. Who do you trust with the launch codes? Who deserves the immense responsibility of controlling the lives of our mothers, fathers, brothers and sisters in the Armed Forces?
Dave: I would like people to walk away from the film feeling entertained of course but outside of that maybe a little stress and frustration. I want them to want to ask questions. To themselves, to each other and mostly to their people in power. Is what we’re doing even right? Do we have the right people making the right decisions? A lot can change with the push of a button or the pull of a trigger. I want the audience to appreciate and consider those facts.
Caption from Black Bag
Where did you find actors for your film?
Lee: Many of the actors in Black Bag I’ve worked with before – often more than once. Steve Kasan and I go back to 2013 when we worked on a webseries called Asset together. Since then, I’ve casted him in several projects including shorts and feature films – most recently In its Wake in 2018. I met Rob Notman while working on a movie in 2016 called Get the Sucker Back and have casted him in several projects. Paul Chiusolo was a newcomer for me on this project – though I would work with him again in a heartbeat. Sergei Fomine doesn’t act very often but is one of my oldest friends and was my roommate when I first began working in the industry.
Dave: Lee being the awesome person that he is has made many connections in the industry and we’ve been lucky enough to make some great friends along the way as well. Friends that share similar passions and interests. In my experience working with Lee, he has maintained an amazing balance between professional and personal relationships that has made it easy to continue working with a lot of the same people and group of friends. Lee and I had many discussions as to who we thought would best suit each role. Realizing we had a list of some talented and reliable people, it made our decisions that much easier.
How big was your team when working on this project?
Lee: We kept our team pretty small throughout the production process because we were shooting in July of 2020 – right in the middle of the second wave of COVID-19 here in Canada. It was challenging having so few people on set to help, and maintaining the proper safety measures to ensure everyone would feel comfortable. The challenge only made us all better filmmakers and inspired us to find creative ways around problems.
Dave: I think we had just under the recommended number of people in doors at one time, following protocols and guidelines made for possibly one of the most interesting sets/projects I’ve been a part of.
Did you find any problems during this film production?
Lee: Our biggest challenge the day we shot was that it was raining a LOT. We had to set up tents outside to house and protect our lights and then contend with leaks and flooding around our power cables while we were shooting. That and the global pandemic.
Dave: Well, outside of making sure our cast and crew were comfortable with being on set due to COVID-19, that day we were dealing with one heck of a rain storm. It was relentless. We had lighting and other equipment that needed to stay outside so the challenge was keeping everything dry and preventing leaks and flooding into the basement we were filming in.
Caption from Black Bag
And how long did the film production last?
Lee: We shot the entire movie in one day with the cutaways of Rob Notman as the drone pilot about a week later. Post-production was a long process because the movie was fully self-financed and so we had to spread out the expenses as we completed the film. We couldn’t have done it without getting huge favours from friends (for example our amazing original score from my good friend Gagan Singh and our awesome colourist Mike Donis).
Dave: Luckily we had everything planned and well organized. Lee and I had put together all of the wardrobe and set design the night before, completely self-financed. With everyone’s schedule being all over the place, we had to make due with pulling this off in one day. With the exception of a seperate very small shoot for some cutaway scenes.
Lee, why and how did you decide to become a film director? And you, Dave, how did youdecide to become a producer?
Lee: I love movies. Movies have been a huge part of my life. Growing up I would watch movies with my brother and friends. My Grandfather used to record movies off the TV onto blank VHS tapes and categorize them in this blue book. I remember sitting on his lap and going through the pages reading the titles while he told me about each movie from memory. I’m actually surprised it took me so long to figure out I wanted to make movies because as a kid I used to sneak my parent’s Hi-8 camcorder and film my action figures to tell exciting stories to my friends. I would tie threads to them and drag them around to simulate them walking and moving and my brother and I would do all the voices!
Dave: I’ve been a fan of movies and the military and tactical genre for some time. Growing up, I’ve found many ways of expressing my artistic vision. I used to do a lot of sketching. Mostly action scenes and heroes. Eventually growing into another small hobby, action figure photography, where I was once again able to create the vision I had loaded with action and cool characters. learning a lot about continuity and lighting in the process. The older I got and the more involved I became with Lee’s projects, the more I knew I had a passion for it and needed to take a bigger part in it.
Have you studied cinematography anywhere?
Lee: I studied Film and Cinema at the University of Toronto as well as History. I credit my prof. Garry Leonard with helping me discover and focus my efforts in the film industry.
Dave: I have not had any form of formal education when it comes to film. Just some fairly basic photography knowledge and a passion for film and movies.
Caption from Black Bag
In your opinion, is education important if a person wants to create films?
Lee: Education is vital for the act of creating film or any art. That being said, “education” can mean a lot of things and to discredit people telling stories from their personal experience, from their lived life or career experiences would be a disservice to the work. Film requires many people with many types of education and experience to be good, let alone excellent. Formal education can be helpful, but I would say lived experience and the education you earn through day-to-day activities and work are more important for telling a compelling story.
Dave: Education/knowledge of your craft is essential. Sadly I have no proper film education. I had many other ways of making sure I had creative input. In the end, I was fortunate to have Lee working beside me with his vast knowledge and experience to help guide and teach me as we chipped away at this and other projects before this one and since.
What do you think, is it real to change the world/situations/minds through this art –cinematography? Have you seen the progress, being so many years in this industry?
Lee: I think anyone and anything has the potential to make a difference if it’s done well and appears at the right time. That difference isn’t always lasting, and it might not have the reach that we always hope for. I mean, your work probably won’t change the world for everyone, but maybe you can change the world for one person. I know people who stopped drinking because of a movie. In 2008, Blood Diamond impacted how all of Hollywood purchased their jewelry. Movies can have small personal impacts, and can also change entire industries.
Sometimes these changes are lasting and sometimes they take forever to become evident. We need to stop thinking of history as an arc that ends “now” because that implies that if we can’t see the results in this moment, then nothing has changed. We’re only privy to a tiny window of history and we can’t even begin to comprehend all the impacts our works can have. All that matters is that we keep trying to do better, to educate, and to improve the lives of everyone in our global community.
Dave: Personally I haven’t spent that long in the film industry, but I firmly believe that art has an incredible ability to change opinions, situations, point of views etc. An incredible ability to make us feel emotion and open our eyes to something more. Something deeper. I would like to see myself as being an artist my entire life, in some form or another. In that respect, I can say I have many years under my belt.
Some of the most memorable and mind altering pieces of art I’ve seen were while I was on a trip in Derry, Ireland. A monument called Bloody Sunday Memorial. A beautiful granite obelisk to commemorate 14 civilians that were shot dead by the British Army on «Bloody Sunday», January 1972. This monument is surrounded by moving paintings and graffiti on small buildings and structures that remind the locals and visitors alike of what happened and what has changed since that dark day.
Caption from Black Bag
Are you working on new projects now? Maybe a new project together?
Lee: Yes! First and foremost, we’re kind of still working on this. Black Bag is only the beginning. This sort of film is kind of a “cold open” for a feature-length movie and we have a really amazing script that continues the story as a young NSA agent investigates the mission and seeks justice for the guys who died. We’ve done a ton of work preparing and planning the rest of the movie and we’re hoping that getting Black Bag out there might help us find the financing we need to finish it.
Dave: Life has changed a lot over the last few years with COVID -19 having affected me a great deal financially. As I’m aware so many others have experienced. I’ve had to make changes to day when it comes to work so I can continue to keep my head above water. That keeps me busier than I’d like it to, leaving me with little time for projects such as these. However! This project isn’t even complete. As I mentioned in a previous comment, this project has a bigger vision. Definitely more to come between Lee and myself. I will always find a way to make time. My passion for this form of art will be life-long.
What disadvantages do you find in your job? And then what do you like about it?
Lee: I love making movies. I love working in a creative space, I love new challenges every day and meeting amazing people. Like most art, it’s hard to make consistent income and find financing for projects. I wish there were easier ways to create, and clearer distribution pathways for completed projects.
Dave: Sadly, film and making movies is not my job or my main source of income. I work as a personal trainer/physical educator and have a separate side job to help pay the bills. The only real disadvantage to that, however, is I don’t have as much time as I would like to have anymore for projects such as these. When they come around, boy are they worth it.
Why did you decide to take part in various film festivals?
Lee: We wanted to get our story and our message out there and share it with the world. We’re really proud of this movie and we hope people like it. We really hope for the chance to tell the rest of the story!
Dave: When Lee mentioned to me that he wanted to submit our work to some festivals, I was of course on board. Any opportunity that we can get to have our artistic vision seen by others, let alone appreciated. I think I speak for both of us when I say, we will always be on board.
Caption from Black Bag
Would you like to work in big feature films as a director and a producer?
Lee: Of course! I’ve produced a couple of Feature Films in the past. Nuptials just screened at the Cyprus International Film Festival and is going to be screening at the Austin Revolution Film Festival in February. I also directed a horror movie called In Its Wake starring Elvis Stojko that should be available on DVD/Bluray and streaming early next year. I’d love to keep making more movies with bigger budgets and really explore creatively.
Dave: I would! It was at one point in my life a bigger desire to pursue something of a career in the film industry but things have changed so much in my life to see that as being a realistic option for myself. Lee is my closest friend and I will always support his work and help in any way I can. Especially with this project and others he invites me to be a part of. I find it incredibly flattering and an honor even, to be included or be a part of anything Lee is working on.
If a window or door opened for me in this industry, I think I would have a very hard time turning down that kind of opportunity.
Would you like to go abroad and try to make films in other countries, for example, in theUSA, Hollywood?
Lee: That’s the dream. The idea of seeing the world while making movies is what I have dreamed of since I was in school. I’d love to film in the mountains of Japan, or the Sahara, or in the beautiful subways in Moscow. There’s so much world to see and I want to see all of it – being able to share it through my art would be a dream come true.
Dave: Bouncing off the last question, I would have to say, yes. I will continue to work hard on these types of projects with Lee when they come around and I’m hopeful and excited to see what kind of opportunities are presented to us in the future. Seeing the world and being able to create artistically in such a way, does sound like a dream.
Do you agree that any film always needs to be filled with serious problems and ideas?
Lee: Of course not! I think movies need to have something to say, but it doesn’t always have to be serious or dark. One of my favourite movies is Mike Judge’s Office Space. It’s a really funny, silly movie, but it has a message. It tells us to think differently in how we perceive work and responsibility and to find what is fulfilling to us personally – not what we’re necessarily expected to do.
Dave: I don’t. Art comes in many forms and expressions. I like to be surprised and like the feeling of unpredictability. If there is a message of some sort and it makes me feel something, I’m happy to have sat through it or experienced it.
In your opinion, are there enough opportunities today for young creators to put their ideas in life?
Lee: Yes and no. I think we need more meaningful ways for people to express themselves. Everyone nowadays can start a YouTube channel or Instagram and publish their work for the world to see. That’s a great thing – the problem is that when everyone has a voice, it’s harder for the individual to be heard, especially those people in marginalized communities. I think we need to find better ways of allowing people who have something important to say, speak. We need a platform that doesn’t have as steep an initiation cost. Making movies is really expensive, and even submitting to festivals costs money and that immediately makes it harder for folks with less financial security to participate and get their stories out there.
Dave: That’s a tough one. I think I feel like there isn’t enough drive anymore to make anything with enough originality or substance. Too many people are just trying to push out their idea as quickly as possible to make a buck. I know that’s a pretty severe generalization and am more than aware of the amount of talent and quality out there in our younger aspiring filmmakers. Maybe I’m focusing too much on the idea of a «TikTok» generation.
I think we need better ways than social media platforms for young creators to have their voice and artistic visions heard and seen. If the individual or group of individuals can find the right avenue or source (such as festivals) to display their work then my hat goes off to them.
Are you pleased with the feedback that you are getting from the audience about your films?
Lee: So far, we’ve been getting really amazing feedback for our project, and we are so thankful and so proud that people are enjoying it. I don’t use a lot of social media to be honest – I don’t have time to dedicate to hashtags and followers. I’d much rather spend my time creating!
Dave: We’ve been very happy with the feedback we’ve been getting. Again, we’re fortunate enough to know some great people that we’ve been able to show this project to, and we’ve been happy with the reactions so far. We decided to reach out to the right people as well as try our hand at some film festivals. We’re happy to have this opportunity.
If you had an opportunity to work with any favorite directors, who would be these people?
Lee: Oh man, it’s hard to narrow it down. I would want to work with Kathryn Bigelow on a Rainbow Six movie, I would want to work with Michael Bay on a Mech Warrior movie, and I would love to work with Darren Aronofskyon an adaptation of Philip K. Dick’s Three Stigmata of Palmer Eldritch.
Dave: I believe Lee and I have had this exact discussion before and would probably even gamble to say that we have a similar response. Kathryn Bigelow, director of movies like, The Hurt Locker and Zero Dark Thirty brings an incredible level of realism to her movies that make me feel like I’m right there in the thick of it. I love her vision and ability to execute it. I’ve been excited to see everything she has directed and have had the thought of her being the right person to properly put together a, Rainbow Six movie. A couple others that pop into my mind would have to be Michael Bay and Antoine Fuqua.High level of admiration and appreciation goes to all the names mentioned.
DREAM MOVIE YOU WOULD LIKE TO FILM
Lee: movie about the battle of Vimy Ridge
DAVE: movie about a special operations soldier in a ‘one man army’ type of situation
Moniek van der Kallen is a dance film director from the Netherlands. Her last project «Exhale» is a kind of those films that make you feel lots of things at the same time. From reflection to anger, it evokes a palette of emotions in your own soul and body.
Exhale starts in shock, when a traumatic event makes you aware of your vulnerability. Your reality has been affected. Can you trust your senses?
We talked to Moniek and found out why she chose this theme for her film, what was her inspiration for creating such an aesthetically beautiful project and how interesting it is to film dance art.
Caption from “Exhale”
Tell us more about the idea of creating this film. How did it come to your mind and what was your inspiration?
Around 10 years ago one idea came to my mind about synchronized swimmers. Why do we usually see only perfect lags flowing above water while everything is happening underneath? But it is there where really hard work is being done. These swimmers are used to being upside down although ordinary people are not. Doesn’t this deserve to be shown? So that’s where my inspiration originally started. I decided to create a trilogy that will include all this magnificent choreography. The first dance movie is about learning to trust someone else except yourself. The second one is about the situation when someone breaks that trust. And the third part “Exhale” is about how to regain confidence in your instincts and overcome your trauma.
Talking more about my inspiration, at the beginning of working on this project I mainly referenced dance photographs. Sometime later I watched Euphoria and was impressed by the atmosphere of this series. I discovered a lot of camera tricks and new ways of shooting. And I tried to repeat some of them.
As you say in the description, the key emotions of your work are vulnerability, powerlessness, anger, and confidence.But why exactly these emotions did you want to evoke in the audience with your film?
I think that in our society we are trying to push away hard feelings. And I do that too. But this time I wanted to experience all these emotions by myself. I wanted to overcome them and leave them with a hopeful ending. I realized that sometimes it is really good to feel the feelings even if they are dark. It’s good to be able to live with them and give them a place in your heart. The main aim of this project is to remind people that it is good to have feelings. I want everyone to know that it is real to overcome difficult stuff, learn from it, and be a better person.
Caption from “Exhale” , Alicia Verdú Macián
Where did you find the actor for your film?
I worked with Alicia a little bit on another project that used to be filmed at her school. Then, we had an audition for a couple of dance school students and decided to take her. We had some acting and choreography exercises when working on that project. She is a great choreographer. After that experience, I knew she would be able to do both the dance and acting parts already for my project. And so she did. I only gave her prompts and instructions but the rest she did herself.
And how did the film production go?
We had this concept a long time ago but filmed it only during quarantine. During production itself, we had to follow strict regulations. In the Netherlands, we got an opportunity to film again only in the summer. But even then, of course, we were keeping a distance and things like that. It was not easy. Alicia had to come to us from Spain with the risk of being placed in quarantine. But luckily she was fine so we didn’t force this problem.
We filmed for two days: the first one was in a studio and the second one – in a swimming pool. The dancer did a short training with divers but when shooting she was underwater on her own.
How did you manage to make so many authentic visual components in your film?
Our previous film ended with a shot going into the eye. And that’s why we started “Exhale” with it. We wanted to show that sometimes the fear comes from inside of you, it’s an internal thing. You can be very scared but have to deal with it. We wanted to make it visible so we focused on the visual part of our film. Our aim was to show that she was in turmoil. After someone’s made you hurt, it’s hard to overcome your fears. You have to recalibrate and figure out what is real and what is not. This feeling is like three days of confusion when you are trying to understand what’s going on, what’s upside down. And I wanted to embody that in filming all the different angles.
Caption from “Exhale”
Once I read that if you put on glasses that turn your vision upside down, three days after your brain will get used to that and after putting the glasses off, the vision will stay the same. And again it will take three days for your brain to change it back. And that’s what is happening to my character. And so I felt when once in my life, someone was telling me things about the world that happened to be not true. And when I found out about it, I was really shocked. It took me several days to understand what exactly did happen. So this feeling of not knowing what is real and what is not I wanted to put in this film.
Why did you decide to take part in various film festivals?
Dance films are a really small niche and I’d like to share them with a bigger audience. I’m so proud of the work and want many people to see it and maybe relate. I want people to see that it can be narrative and healing. I hope someone will be watching it and feeling some stuff out of it.
How can you promote your projects in the Netherlands?
Mainly there is one big dance film festival – Cinedans – in Amsterdam. We are really glad that they took our project as a part of their program. Unfortunately, it was only online this time. But it was already a success. Now we are talking about showing our short film before full features at the cinemas or maybe even creating a short films program. But obviously it’s difficult to organize because dance films are not typical for cinemas.
And, of course, I try to share my projects on various social networking sites. First and second parts of this trilogy are already on YouTube and Vimeo.
When discussing your work, it’s curious to know why and how you decided to become a film director.
Many years ago, with a couple of friends we started to do some film projects outside of school. We experimented with documentaries, fiction, and even promo movies. Sometime later I got paid for my work and we decided to make some dance ideas real. That’s how I got started. But I studied cinematography on my own by reading, learning, and talking about it. Currently, I also have a vlog with lesson programs that I’m making for schools.
The crew of “Exhale” filming
Would you like to work in big feature films as a cinematographer?
I’m not sure I’d love to do that. I’m happy to be able creativity make something great. I love this freedom. And I don’t think I’m cut out for all the stress that big film production contains. I prefer teaching about film aspects. And would like to create more light-hearted and full of color independent dance movies.
But if to go in big industry, I’d like to work on some serious commercial projects that contain great dancing and visual effects. Something that allows you to work with various parts of filming.
Would you like to get some extra education?
That’s an interesting question that I ask myself every few years. I’m sure you are never too old to learn. And personally, I always enjoy learning new stuff. So whenever I get an opportunity to do a master’s class, I’ll take it.
What type of cinematography attracts you most?
Well, I was thinking about going deeper into the commercial projects because bigger budgets give you creative freedom. You can make something crazy, experiment with costumes and choreography. But I’m not discovering the commercial world yet because, honestly, I’m a little bit scared. It is such a responsibility to pitch the idea to the right customer. Today I’m trying to understand what steps I have to do to find the right direction in this field. But I’m definitely interested in it!
We talked with Eddie Baca (producer), Perry Dell»Aquila (director), Marcus Jahn, and Gus Ferrari about the film ‘Look In My Eyes’. The whole film is imbued with an atmosphere of honesty and sincerity. And the same our conversation was. But what history does this story have? Will it be continued? And why is it important today to tell stories like this? — read in this interview.
Caption from ‘Look In My Eyes’
A NYC taxi driver from Crimea meets a sober older gay man. Romance, deception, self truth and acceptance, intrigue. All this is going to be discussed in the following interview but first of all, let us introduce the key cast of ‘Look In My Eyes’.
Marcus Jahn
Aman Singh
Gus Ferrari
Tell us more about the idea of creating this film. How did it come to your mind and what was your inspiration, Eddie?
Eddie: It’s based on a true story. But then, of course, I looked a lot younger than I am now. The AA meeting place where everything happens in the movie is real too, we are sitting here now. I ran it. One night I closed up about 2 in the morning, went to the street corner, got in the taxi and there were these eyes that kept staring at me in the rearview mirror. The driver turned out to be a young man, new in town. He was from Pakistan but for political reasons he had to move to Ukraine and then to the USA. And you know he just fired away all the questions. Literally, the taxi scene is 90% accurate of what happened in real life. The relationship just took off from there.
It took me around 8 years, just writing the script over. I had to be very sensitive to the fact that the world was getting introduced to the muslim community and I didn’t want to do or write anything that would trigger a bad reaction. If you look closer at the portrayal of the muslim community, there was a period, as I think, when the rest of the world, especially Americans, were not knowledgeable about that part of the world. Nobody thought about their true nature, who they and their families were, about their real motivation. And that’s what’s going to happen in my movie later.
What emotion did you want to evoke in the audience with your film?
Eddie: We all come from different backgrounds, we all carry certain political baggage and personal beliefs with us and often we can’t get beyond those issues, we can’t really form a union with another person where love prevails over everything and gets people to think of going to another part of the world and have a completely different life with somebody they love.
Captions from ‘Look In My Eyes’
How was the cast formed?
Marcus: It started as any other normal audition where you see the casting call and apply “Hey, maybe I’m right for this role”. But what was really great about this experience is that my audition was basically a meeting with Eddie and Perry of just getting to know each other a little bit. It was important to get this unique connection when we started to discover the personalities of each other. And what was so different about this project is that usually you are not going to meet that actual person in real life which your character is based on. But I had Eddie all the time and that resource was such an amazing experience frankly. I was very fortunate to get it.
Gus: And about me, I’ve been doing theater and film for about 25 years now. I came on board when this story was a play. One friend of mine told me about Perry who was looking for people to be in this place and that’s how I got involved in “Look In My Eyes”. The play went well and Eddie mentioned that one day he would like to make a film. And sometime later he suggested taking up the role of Stefano, my character, in the film. This character is close to me as a person so I felt comfortable when playing him. I really like the script and the way my character is.
How was this experience for you as an actor, Mascus?
Marcus: It wasn’t my first project but I’m thinking it was the longest one and the biggest thing I’ve done for now. The production itself was real chaos as every independent filmmaking is. But at the same time, it was so charmed where everything came together. I’ve never been so happy with any of my performances before. After seeing it, I just got the feeling that it was better than I could have ever imagined. It was a blessing and honor to be a part of this project.
Then maybe you already have some plans for your actor’s carreer?
Marcus: That’s a really good question. I’ve been in New York acting for about 5 years and the first couple of years were very rough, to be honest. And NY is actually known as a theater city while LA is a film one. But I really feel very grateful for being here. It was my first dream — to live in NY — even before I understood I dream to be an actor. NY is full of hungry, ambitious, talented filmmakers who just want to make art, and to be a part of – it is priceless. So I want to stay here and do everything I can as long as possible. It’s such a privilege to be able to create something magical.
The crew of ‘Look In My Eyes’ filming
And what about you, Gus? In your opinion, is it hard to realize your ambitions and potential when you are a young actor?
Gus: Obviously, every actor would love to be a part of a big Hollywood production and so would I. Although I am a New Yorker and don’t see myself living there, I would work there and try this experience of being involved in big studio production. Today the situation with independent movies is better than it used to be. There’s a lot of independent film happening in NY now and also in Atlanta. But as a theater actor, I’m glad to be in the heart of the American theater world.
Coming back to the film production, how long did it last?
Perry: When Eddie first told me this story, I understood that this should be a play. So we originally did it as a play, in front of the audience. When Eddie decided to make a film out of this great story, I directed it. We filmed everything in one location, in this building in New York. It was a crazy film production. It took only several weeks. The bulk of the movie was shot in nine days. Of course, we went back to reshooting but not so often. And I would say it was pretty terrific because New York City at night is a crazy place and we were literally on the streets where everyone wanted to see what we were doing. Yes, it was crazy but you can do something like that only in this city because the story happened exactly here.
Eddie: It should be noticed that I’ve written all my life. But I’ve never produced anything before. And this was my first experience and it was so great. I’ve learned so much from it. And yes, our movie was filmed in one room. We separated it into several areas which later became the dining room, the living room, the bedroom and it worked. We had one more room for the clubhouse where people who are troubled are coming in for help. It was all filmed here. We also took advantage of the outside in terms of one entrance was for the clubhouse and another one for the apartment.
Did you force any problems during filming?
Perry: We did. Sometimes we need a permit to film in NY on the streets which we didn’t have so all the time we were looking over our shoulders. Besides, this city is so loud that we had to refilm scenes lots of times when someone honked their horn. But we had a great advantage called Eddie. Every time when we were having problems with the scene, all we did was talking to Eddie who knew what happened and how to tell this story right.
Eddie: Previously Perry mentioned that we did a play before that. We had a principal actor in there and actually not everyone liked him, the way he positioned himself on stage and in real life. So we learned from that trial and did everything to not duplicate that situation here. And when it came down to filming, there was a lot of harmony in doing this. Of course we had issues with each other and who wouldn’t? But they were always able to be worked through.
Cast of ‘Look In My Eyes’. From left to right: Marcus Jahn, Eddie Baca, Aman Singh
How big was your team when working on this project?
Perry: We had a cinematographer, one person to do the light and one to do the sound. All others were actors and several extras – people in the background. And that’s all.
Gus: Every film production is spontaneous and dynamic and ours was so too. We all had to put several hats so while I wasn’t acting, I helped with the lights or microphone. Oh, and Ezra’s apartment decor is also the result of my creativity. I got in touch with my feminine side and picked all the stuff for him.
Eddie: I even gave Gus my credit card when I wasn’t able to find an apartment to rent. And he got every item perfect!
Where are you getting the feedback from the audience?
Eddie: We just started submitting it to various festivals. And that’s kind of the direction that I’d like to move in. There are so many angles that you can expand upon after this. I was just really pleased that the outcome was great because during the process I wasn’t sure how this movie was going to end up.
Caption from ‘Look In My Eyes’
Will this story have a continuation?
Eddie: I’ve written so many different versions of it. There’s an expectation in the current movie that the main character’s mother is coming with the two brothers. There’s that angle. Besides, I really went through the symbolism with Marcus playing a Jewish character and Aman playing a Muslim but this fact was never an issue between the two of them in terms of how they related to each other. So we have that and it could play out. And there is just a lot of material that we can go into.
Perry: The film is certainly not over. There’s so much more of the story to tell and I think that’s the way it’s gonna proceed as a web series. Because even in the play there was a lot more that we didn’t put in the film yet. And it was just a stop at a moment but there’s so much more to come. The current ending allows us to even do a flashback of the characters’ lives before they met in the cab.
How difficult is it to create an independent movie today?
Perry: These days I think it’s a lot easier and accessible to make a movie in general. Anyone can do it now. Back in the day when I went to film school, you had to rent these big cameras and needed a crew and permits. Today it’s not like that anymore. If you have a story to tell, you can find many ways how to do it. It doesn’t even necessarily have to go through the film festivals circuit. You can film the project and stream it on different sites and it will take off from there. And then someone of importance with finance will notice it and help you out. Twenty years ago it was unreal.
Eddie: Two things worked in our favor. One is – risk. You have to take a risk in doing an independent movie. Usually, you gather all your savings and decide to invest in your project. Hopefully, it’ll pay off and the returns come back. The second thing is the pandemic. It really worked in terms of having the space and time to do this movie.
It was mentioned that this story firstly used to be a play so you all came to the cinema from the theater. But how did you get involved in the theater world?
Gus: I used to be into music before, I played with bands. I even tried to produce a record but it didn’t work out. So I didn’t know what to do. I wanted to be in the arts but didn’t know how to do that. One day I randomly found an ad in a newspaper where they were looking for movie extras. I thought that it sounded like a fun job and I just showed up and did it for free. I hang out around movie set and found all that process really interesting. I didn’t know before how movies were made. One friend of mine suggested me to take some acting classes. So I did. I was lucky enough to be a part of a group that was involved in working with Moscow Theater and they invited us to do the Stanislavski’s seminar. It was great and I learned a lot from there. And I’ve been doing theater and film since the early 90-s.
Perry: Well, I went to the American Academy of dramatic arts for acting. So I started as an actor. Then I went to a film school and worked on Broadway in the theater. That was my survival job. And then over the years, it transferred over to theater directing. What I would do is someone would come to me with a story and we would make it into a solo one-man show. I’ve done lots of such shows. And we also turned Eddie’s short story into a play.
Caption from ‘Look In My Eyes’
Is it really necessary to get some education if you want to become a part of the film industry?
Perry: I think it’s important to have a good base of knowledge and then you can be creative from there. If you don’t know the basics, you are going to be in trouble. Not everybody has an opportunity to learn from being an apprentice. For example, when working on this project we had our sound person and our lightning person and they were talking like another language to me at first. And the sound person told me that she knows all these terms because she did get a basic knowledge of how everything works.
Marcus: Talking about me, it’s funny because I went to a college and my main focus there wasn’t acting. I studied political science ad criminal justice. I was a member of a theater but only as I got through college, I realized that that’s actually what I wanted to do with my life. I went to a four-year university in Wisconsin and majored in theater. And I agree with Perry, especially on the technical side. You really need to know that language. But honestly, moving out to NY and trying to be an actor and doing it, I’d say I learned 10 times more from that experience, especially in my first year than in university.
Eddie, as the creator of this story with a rather serious political idea inside of it, do you think it can change something in people’s minds and life?
Eddie: I’ve always had a political background. Politics is in my blood. From this experience I learned that cinematography is a very powerful tool for putting out different messages and also for highlighting people in other parts of the world that the rest of the world have no idea what their life experience is about. And cinematography can keep it alive forever while regular media tell you certain information only for several days. Then these stories disappear and the media’s focus moves on to something else. But a movie is forever and it can always be played over and over again keeping these ideas alive.
Can you name your favourite scene in the movie and something you would like to change?
Perry: My favorite scene is in the cab in the beginning. I love it because it sets the whole mood and the whole catalyst for the rest of the movie. I think it looks beautiful although the night when we filmed it was real chaos. And that’s why I love it so much. As a director, I always want to change something in a project. So it’s hard to name one certain moment or scene.
Cast of ‘Look In My Eyes’. From left to right: Perry Dell»Aquila, Marcus Jahn, Aman Singh
Eddie: For me, the best scene is that one when they are talking and arguing and actually they both understand how much in love they are with each other. When we were filming it, nobody around said a word. It was so emotional. Someone even cried during it. About the moment that I would change, well, I think it’s the scene when a guest stays for a night at Ezra’s home. I didn’t get the impact I wanted to from the final version of the movie.
Gus: I’m very pleased with the final result. As an actor, I always think how differently I could do this or that scene when I’m watching a movie. But I know that we should just trust our director. So did I. And you know, my favorite scene is when Ezra and I argue about Ramzi. Both of us were emotionally invested. That scene had a great dynamic. I love it.
Marios P. Papageorgiou is a director from Greece. He definitely has his own vision of the world, cinematography and art. We talked with Marios about his last cinematic short length venture «Shadows of the World», found out what deep meaning he always strives to bring in and out of the Art and how it is to be a Greek cinematographer.
Marios P. Papageorgiou
Tell us more about the idea of creating this film. How did it come to your mind and what was your inspiration? Why exactly this idea?
Shadows of the World started to shape their outline in my mind on a summer afternoon. Somewhere in a light sleep bothered by the sun’s rays. We could say that they were born in the space between “sleep-awakeness”. But this was the natural upshot of a conception as birth in biological terms. However, the gestation of the idea is the one that in essence has its deep meaning.
The outcome of my ontological approach on “Cinematography” and not on Cinema. This differentiation “Cinematography & Cinema” is not mine of course. It belongs to Robert Bresson, the first who made this nuance distinguishable. This has been the trigger. Driven by this and experiencing as a filmmaker and active viewer the negative characteristics that have upended the cinematic narration, I developed a personal need with regards to my creative orientation: …the return to the years of the pioneers and of the formers of the Seventh Art. The discovery, anew, of the substance of the images and the sounds which compose a film. Due to the fact that this may be a “sophism-trap”, what I mean is the personal penetration of each and every filmmaker into themselves, seeking for the substance of their “being” in relation with the primary desire of “making films”. As in L’Atalante (1934) directed by Jean Vigo, Jean (Jean Dasté) dives into the water of the sea yearning for his wife, Julienne (Dita Parlo) who had abandoned him seeking out a better fortune. Obviously, he will not find her at the bottom of the sea, but through his hearty feeling, his deep desire for them to be together again, he dives and by swimming his way through, she appears as a visionary figure. This is what has almost completely died off nowadays.
As far as Shadows of the World is concerned, the film – or better the idea upon which the film has been built – appeared in my mind unexpectedly. Carving the idea, the screenplay was developed, some scenes and aspects of the characters were presented so that they all came to bind the two edges: the fundamental stone of the idea with the way the film would finish. Now, why exactly this idea, good question…. I am troubled about the end of the world, not as news or as a scattered concern, but as the narrator of the film also says in the beginning: “Remnants of death budging in absentia in the breath of air. Soulless eyes will be bearing dead desires. Death, however, is of no match to its specter. Fooling yourself is nice. When you die, how far-reaching is your death?”. And I looked for an original way for this, although almost everyone says “All has been done… there is no parthenogenesis”. Please allow me to say that there is something… And this can be called “interactive originality”.
Caption from Shadows of the World
What emotion did you want to evoke in the audience with your film?
You put it nicely. The verb “evoke” is the most appropriate. Shadows of the World is a pessimistic film. Hope is a word apparently non-existent in the narrative turn of the film. I mean, that even Fate is exterminated since anything ceases to exist. So, firstly, it depends on how anyone counts the pessimism inside them. A great Greek poet, Kostas Karyotakis, had written before he commits suicide with a gun – after his attempt to drown in the sea, where he did not make it since he knew how to swim – “I commit suicide because you do not have visions”. It is important how a reader will let this phrase permeate the inside of him/her. Namely, how we contemplate what is transfused to us by the images and sounds. How our inside is altered. How does our inner world act before Johnny’s (Timothy Bottoms) torso, who with his inner voice echoing his agony in Johnnie Got His Gun (1971)!? What will anyone do with Alain’s (Maurice Ronet) suicide in Le feu Follet (1963)or with Erwin’s (Volker Spengler) In einem Jahr mit 13 Monden (1978)?!
Now, as far as our film Shadows of the World is concerned, what I would like to evoke in the audience is… the “smoke”, a cloud of dust not thick, but of the ones that have started to dissolve and when you look at them, the imagination of the mind starts to shape the “……» that the devastation has scattered.
The film may be referring to the climate change that will bring the total natural destruction of the planet, but it is not scheduled to outline this. My choice was an avant-guarde way of cinematographic approach. A science fiction film – not so obvious – dealing with memory in the spectrum of the irrevocable end. That is the actual purpose of the photo stories of the four people finding refuge underearth in a vast eerie zone, where they appear to be the only survivors. Down there – some may liken the space to a “purgatory” – the four men’s conscience will be tested by something that in the film is depicted as a surrealistic symbolism. A surrealistic element in an expressionistic atmosphere. Nevertheless, this surrealistic element – and I would like to point this out – does not invade the film arbitrarily, it does not spring up from anywhere and by this, I mean, it does not impose itself by the screenplay or the direction. It emerges from the stressful situation the character has been circumstanced after a catastrophe of biblical dimensions. This is how it is released from the heart of darkness and this is how it penetrates reality.
The co-producer and distributor of the film, Marcel Michalaris, at some point, when he saw the film, told me that Shadows of the World is an American film with a European narration. An approach like that opens prospects for the film to be embraced by quite a lot of people.
Initially, it is a silent film. And I say silent because, although there is a narrator at the beginning of the film, the film in the rest of its duration is made in the style of silent cinema – not in an imitative way neither with the purpose the silence in the film to expand as an imposed aesthetic form of expression. Silence in Shadows of the World is emerging – let us say – from the ruthless conditions portrayed in the film. The events unfold in the time density of 19 moments and 28 seconds, with the end titles being made with special care: there are photos – rendered with the daguerreotype aesthetic – of ruined landscapes smoking. The aesthetic style of daguerreotype connects us with the far distant past and the outer future. They emit the sense of time osmosis. «It may have happened in the past…. It may happen in the future…. Or…even now…in a few minutes…» as the narrator says.
Ah, Shadows of the World also have a fighting sequence following the standards of classic swashbuckling films.
Where did you find actors for your film?
The film has suffered a lot of misfortunes. Some of them had to do with actors, but this was helped at the most by those you see on the screen. Some of them stood firmly by the vision of Shadows of the World from the beginning till the end. And some came later…either as a replacement of a poor-spirited actor either the most painful….the suicide of one of the actors (and a very close friend of mine). In the first case, the man who choreographed the duel introduced me another actor. This actor – Yannis Papaioannou – has been something more than a miracle for the film.
I have to add to this that in the photo stories because the photo stories sequences have been shot with the poor-spirited actor and could not be made again, we shot against green box the head of Yannis Papaioannou in the various body postures and the sought out feeling on the facial expressions and we replaced it with the head of the other actor. Therefore, in the photo stories, the head of Yannis Papaioannou exists on another person’s body.
As far as Yorgos Konstas is concerned, his death occurred after the photostory we had shot for his film character. His photostory could have been shot again. But my personal desire was to preserve his presence in the film. That is the reason why in the live-action we looked for an actor of similar body type and profile and with bounteous artistic sensitivity, we tried to build the figure of the departed. The very end of the film is accompanied by a relevant note. Shadows of the World is dedicated to him. He has been one of the greatest actors in Greece and one excellent stage director. I was calling him… the Greek Jack Lemmon.
Captions from Shadows of the World
How big was your team when working on this project? And how long did the film production last?
The film could not – de facto – have at its disposal the required staff which is necessary for a film – even a short film. Anyone who will watch the film will see that it is about a film of high standards. In this respect, enough people did a lot of things out of the scope of their responsibilities. The director was carrying bags full of rubble, the set designer carried out more tasks since basically she did not have an assistant, the special make-up effects & prosthetics artist was painting on the walls and many more people close to me – not related to the film business – were devoted to the film. Shadows of the World lacks a lot of professional specialties that we meet in standard productions.
However, in Greece, most movies are made in this way, since this is the main way to release the dream from your mind and see it materialized. To make …if possible…a film at your own expense. Otherwise, you have to wait for the government entities, if you are approved. Anyway, it is known that the evaluation of the films approved is not only based on purely film quality criteria. The specific film has not been approved twice. However, I rush to say that its screenplay was only descriptions since there were no dialogues: how the looks of the people are, how their clothes look, and of course the action description. But although they saw the film finished, our application for financial support was not approved either.
Anyway, I had estimated that the film could be made if I would work hard myself in order to pay it off. And this is what happened. I was saving some money to start the film and I was saving even more money in order to pay it off. The great thing is that between the members of the crew a relationship of hearty trust was built from the beginning. While I was doing two-three jobs before and after the end of the shooting, the film made it to finish in a long term. There were periods, as it is natural – and for various reasons – when the film in the stage of pos-production was “crawling”. If it were not for the help of one of the top-ranking film critics globally, Giannis Bacogiannopoulos, one of the most important directors of Cinema, Stavros Tsiolis and my companion, the film would have finished just about now.
Why and how did you decide to become a film director?
My “cinema godfather” and my father have been the sparks that lighted up the flame inside me. The first was a director of a savings bank, the other was a judge. Apparently irrelevant to the field of Arts. And yet…!
Watching films with them is remembered as sacramental ritual. Since I was 5 years old I had started to take in images and sounds of classic cinematography. It does not matter how much I understood back then, the important thing was that I felt deeply overwhelmed. The meaning of the “Myth” in the Arts has played a crucial part in my life. At an unspecified moment when I had grown up, I swallowed the bait of all those times of the past and the desire to become a filmmaker lighted up in me.
But the moment of the great realization came when I was 14 years old, and the day was Saturday. Then, I saw on TV Fort Apache (1948) directed by John Ford. Εh, and probably at some moment of viewing Fort Apache I must have vociferated inside me “That was it…It is over, finished. By Cinema I will live, Cinema will lead me to death….”
The onset photos of shooting Shadows of the World
It’s said that you studied Film & Television in Greece and Scotland. Can you tell more about this experience and how studying changed your mind?
In general, I do not believe in academic studies, although I graduated. The first people that formed the Seventh Art did not attend lectures in some university or go to a school – with the great exception of the Film School of Moscow and VGIK after. The difference is that at those times there was anxiety for the agony of cinematographic expression – as in Italy, as well, with Centro Sperimentale di Cinematografia or the Film School of Lodge in Poland or in Prague. Nowadays, it is the norm, film studies are an easy business to bait people. Nevertheless, there is always the chance to find an insightful professor. But the academic studies are based on two things: what kind of professors you have and what kind of student mates in order to have conversations and to share crucial opinions on Cinematography – also at the level of creative conflict, of course.
When I was studying, I was seeing Dreyer, Antonioni, Cassavetes, Lang, Renoir, Lubitsch, Hawks, Malle, Godard, Truffaut, Rohmer, Eisenstein, Pudovkin, Dovzhenko, Tarkovsky, Parajanov, Ozu, Mizoguchi, and many more and my student mates had hardly heard of Bergman. I remember one of them who liked films like Resident Evil. They were entering into the process of seeing some of the great filmmakers as a museological value. And of course, the lessons were – let us say – theoretical in almost every study year. Where did I learn Cinematography? Watching the prologues of the film critic Giannis Bacogiannopoulos for the TV broadcast Film Club and watching films. I am really speaking seriously…!
I would like to have been assistant to one of the Greek directors that I have loved, but either they have been dead or they were “retired” at the time. In the meantime, among all of these, I joined filmmaking without any past experience.
Captions from Shadows of the World
You have an active civil position. Why haven’t you become a politician in order to solve important social problems in Greece? Why did you choose cinematography?
In an invaluable Greek film, The Children of Cronos (1986) directed by Yorgos Korras, the central character of the film (Takis Moschos) is asked at some point if he will go to the demonstration. And he responds, ” I would rather not go…I will send it in writing. That I disagree with the regime of the military bases. If they want they will take it into account”. I don’t like either to mingle with the vague remarks of the slogans. The expression of the Ideas is drowning in the slogans. The slogans by their very nature are not empathizing. This is it as far as the general mood of my attitude is concerned. I want to say that it is not something I pursue to be present in demonstrations, Ι am flooded by a sense of dissatisfaction, a sense of frustration. In order to participate as a demonstrator there has to be a deep wound that will be caused by an event. But even then, I feel that although a lot of people stand together for a common cause, the distances that separate us are somewhat great. Politically, I prefer to express myself through my Art and my life attitude. This does not mean at all that someone takes the part of the observer.
When I recorded day by day the hunger strike of the immigrants back in 2013, that was a big wound and it still remains one. The people were deceived “from within”: the same political party that organized them to claim their rights…. Only an independent organization preserved its character towards them until the deceitful end, and also after that….
So if demonstrations in their entirety do not express me, let alone Politics. History has proved that through your Art you can always practice Politics – sometimes directly other times indirectly, you can do both and even do it excellently when you are a great filmmaker (see Eisenstein or Ken Loach). Οn the other hand, a politician cannot practice Art οn his part. Art is not the deception of hopes. Very few political leaders managed to touch people as even only a song, a film, a novel, a play did. Exceptions have always been a dissenting track from the rule.
And then is it real to change the world/situations/minds through this art – cinematography? Have you seen the progress, being so many years in this industry?
In spite of any planning, any artist has to let life itself penetrate in his/her work of art. To be able to let the “unexpected” alter his work. Nevertheless, Art is aesthetically superior than life. And by that, I mean, the foreshadowing that offers to our life. We can see a fact of life or death in a film and this could make us feel something that either we can “meet” in some way later on in our own life either this could “overturn” our behavior towards something that we are concerned about during a specific period. It can even change the way we deal with a dispute in the frame of what we call real life.
The world surely cannot change, since we constantly seek for the “ideal” without looking beside us in order to look right directly and introspect our interpersonal relationships. How is anyone to fix the world when they push away the most fundamental thing? It is like football, where the teams pursue to play in the Champions League when they barely groan to pass the group stage in Europa League. Anyway, the only thing we can hope for sure is that few people make “little shelters of dignity” between them. Art in any form contributes to that foremost.
I would just like to mention the film case of Umberto D. (1952) directed by Vittorio De Sica and written by Cesare Zavvatini, at a time when Italy had begun slowly after the war to build its economy de novo. So the film through the portrayal of retired people’s life conditions managed to amend the pension law. And it is not a film made for denouncing this, but it was something that stalked the film’s atmosphere.
Are you working on new projects now?
There are several plans-dreams that accompany me for years. One of them has accompanied me since 2003. By my own means, I have started the preparation for a documentary on Takis Kanellopoulos. In 1961 he had been awarded in the Moscow International Film Festival for a short film documentary, called Thassos. He is one of the greatest poets of Cinematography. An enigmatic case. He made 10 films. Three of them are masterpieces of the World Cinema. His course afterward started to bring dimensions of ancient tragedy. Every film of his had already been a pace, even farther, in the lonely road he was following until his fatal exclusion from every practical cinematographic gesture. It is a documentary of an essay style, exploring the fragile relationship of man with Time, so as the personal myth of Kanellopoulos may connect with pieces and moments of our world.
If this project will be selected for financing, it is something that is awaited to be seen.
Captions from Shadows of the World
How do you deal with a creative crisis?
Having conversations with people I love and I hold great esteem, seeing films, reading, and listening to music, I try to let the knots of any creative crisis to get untied as if they are being untied by themselves. Music is the “invisible sculpture”. Every time when I am before a piece of paper or a laptop screen that has to be filled with scenes, I listen to music; music suitable for giving me inspiration over the screenplay I write. Music always drags up from inside of me the solutions I need; sublime ideas buried among others.
Yet, the problem doesn’t lie in the creative crisis but in the productive crisis. Many times, I bear in mind one moment in my life – I can recall every single detail as if it was a scrutinized film shot – when I had said aloud to myself “You have these scripts. Other written, other developed, and other with notes. They may be a few, but you don’t know if you have the opportunity to make even some of them. So I forbid, self, to think over others too. Don’t bring to your mind and heart more frustrations”. I don’t know if I will keep it up. I want to believe, although, that it reflects something….
What disadvantages do you find in your job? And then what do you like about it?
Since I was a young adolescent – as I mentioned before – I have invested my existence in Cinematography. In the country I live in, this is a disadvantage. Greece, although a cradle of civilization, does not have any connection with contemporary culture. They wait for the summer to get rich from the ancient Greeks. Most of the people who do something are lonely cases. There are also others who have put their artistic dreams in the mode of hibernation….
Furthermore, as I mentioned in the beginning, the cinematic narration has suffered negative changes, lost in the dead-end post-modernisms, films scheduled on social issues – lacking the fever of creation – and Cinematography as a tool for the relief of complexes. I am referring to these briefly, which is unfair to the range of topics itself. By simply saying “I want to talk about this” art cannot be made; the anxiety of expression that will frame the content is also needed.
Why did you decide to take part in various film festivals?
I have decided to participate in various festivals for the justification of the film and for the purpose of sharing it. For some to see it and listen in the “pulse” of the film as they please. I would like to see viewers watch Shadows of the World, with reflections of the film fall upon them lighting their reactions; but the pandemic, first of all, does not allow that. Due to the fact that the film is independent and is distributed by an unknown distributor, it is hard to find its real way. Unfortunately, the films are not judged always by their aesthetic criteria and by how much innovative or breath-taking they are, even if this seems to be the case according to the Festivals. A film by an unknown director, made absolutely independently, distributed by an unknown production company, does not have a lot of luck. That is why the more festivals the film is sent to, always in view of some criteria, the more the chances are for the film to retrieve some of the prestige it loses. Even this possibility does not always exist. And even when it does exist, you have again to weigh many facts and information….
The onset photos of shooting Shadows of the World
Would you like to work in big feature films as a cinematographer?
When you are reflecting on an idea for script development, you should think through the film’s length. The first cut, for example, of Shadows of the World without the end credits lasted 23 minutes. The film was becoming not exactly limp but flabby. It was missing its sharpness. Speaking purely in montage (editing) terms, the film should come to the point to take after glaring on a knife. Someone had suggested to me that the film has the dramaturgical standards to be a full-length film. Of course, my stance is that Shadows of the World do not have such standards. Thus, every story possesses its own narrative time. There are film directors – let us compare it to the literature standards – who, although their film has the plot standards for being a “short story”, give it the length of a novel. They can’t just simply master their ideas within the narrative context required by the story itself.
I have co-written screenplays, that are about to be filmed someday, I hope, and they are feature films. This doesn’t mean that if something shows up having narrative standards for being a short-length film, I won’t return to making a short film. I don’t see the “short film” as a passport for shooting feature films as it is the ordinary case in Greece and everywhere. As there is also the case of “short film” directors-filmmakers that disregard the full-length film as a possible artistic creation. And finally, there is the case of film directors who debuted with a feature film in the field of filmmaking and they consider short films as film exercises, but they indulge in reading short stories. So as the story content brings it out…
How would you describe Greek cinematography?
As I would describe International Cinematography, I would also describe Cinematography in Greece. Cinematography looks like a post-war landscape, where the true filmmakers wander around with skepticism and contemplation as the characters in the neorealistic films among the ruins. Anyway, in a country where in fact lonely cases were always dominant – what an oxymoron is this and how much of a paradox – in a small country like Greece without an essential cinematic tradition, everything is more magnified. The so-called Weird Cinema may have won the international film industry and find also imitators abroad; however, in my opinion, it does not cease to be a formalistic exercise over critical human issues, the complexity depiction of which in the screenplay process looks like a game of who will come up with the weirdest idea that will promote the story, with an hourglass beside measuring time pressingly. To not refer to the vulgarity of those films and by no means I do not mean their subject matters.
Now, about the general picture of Greek Cinematography, I would say that it seems like an (extreme) close-up shot. Specific story style without openings in their expression, pointless screenplays. One thing that has evolved is the wider artistic thoroughness of the films, but in lack of screenplay, everything else looks like a wrapper, just technical skills, but it isn’t so. These so-called technical skills become the narrative breathing of an average or unperceptive or aphasic direction. The really great films are vanishing. Such an example is the last year’s documentary Transfer directed by Elias Giannakakis about the transfer of the National Library from the historical building where it was housed to the Stavros Niarchos Institution – a documentary at the level of Chris Marker. The film has remained almost unseeable. What else to add to that!?
Would you like to go abroad and try to make films in other countries, for example, in the USA, Hollywood?
This is something that does not depend on me. It has to do with the appreciation that someone will show for my work and my relationship with Cinematography. And this can arise from any country. It is of foremost importance that the call will exude respect, it will let you the space for creation. Not only to carry out a film or to frame you into its system, envisioning the creation of a film where afterward you will not recognize yourself in it. As far as the production stages of a film are concerned, the same in a way applies to the director-creator towards anyone who is sponsoring his vision.
The onset photos of shooting Shadows of the World
Do you agree that any film always needs to be filled with serious problems and ideas?
I do not agree at all with this opinion. What does a serious problem mean? Serious problems are extended from the affairs of the heart, as in Jean Renoir’s Une Partie de Campagne (1936), go through Vincente Minnelli’s Some Came Running (1958) and Tarkovsky’s graduate film Ubiytsy (The killers) – (1956) and end up to Dreyer’s Ordet (1955) or Robert Bresson’s Au hazard Balthazar (1966).
Let me just say that one of my favorite film genres is for example musicals. And mainly I mean purely musicals, purebreds without a social plot. The plots of films e.g. with Fred Astaire and Ginger Rodgers were like champagne bubbles. And what of it? These films were not made for this but for their dancing ecstasy. All the rest was a pretext. However, these films played an important social role not to the viewers’ stupefaction, but to the “escape”. Some of Fellini’s mystical aura stems from there.
In your opinion, are there enough opportunities today for young creators to put their ideas in life?
There are opportunities, I would say more than enough. This is certified by the variety of means for making a film. But the thing is the mindset behind the act of filming. It would be better for the young creators, when they say that they love Cinema, to reflect on the magnitude of their emotion towards Cinematography. To look inside them and find the deep connection that will join them with what the lips formulate. We have to be honest with our love for the Arts. Arts are as invaluable as Sciences.
Are you pleased with the feedback that you are getting from the audience about your films? And what platforms do you use for personal promotion?
As for personal promotion, I use social media. Shadows of the World has also its site http://www.shadowsoftheworld-film.com (It has to be updated with the awards and the reviews so far).
Now, the feedback I get from viewers is mainly an expression à bout de souffle. This is conveyed in various ways. I wouldn’t like to descant on comments – and some of them are actually very important for me – because it would appear as conceit on my part. The issue is with the Film Festivals that have come a long way over the decades and disregard Shadows of the World. Often you have the impression that they don’t really see all the submitted films – besides it’s a well-known secret – since they continuously spring up the thousands of films they received or mention the record-breaking number of submissions they had this year. So the feedback from the viewers may fill you with joy and courage, but it fills you also with sadness because they share with you their thoughts – and you actually understand from their sensitive remarks that an “undefined something” motivated them to put themselves into the film. And, on the other hand, the film may not be even seen by a festival program team somewhere abroad or to see it through the method of skipping for reasons I mentioned before. The fact that the big (historical) festivals decline the existence of films which a plethora of festivals out there favor, this discloses something for the rationale of others.
Ian Guevara is a cinematographer from the Philippines. He is making magnificent projects with various creators and local brands. He really feels the magic of the photography and can impress people by his works. We talked to Ian and found out what cinematography means to him, how it is to be a director of photography and why imperfect things are perfect for him.
Ian Alexander B. Guevara
Ian, you are a director of photography. What’s the difference between a director of photography and a film director?
I’m in charge of the visual storytelling of the project. My job is to frame the project and at the same time do that creatively. While a director sometimes would have chosen frames in terms of editing, I would put in some comments to make it looks better. Long story short, with a director we do a lot of stuff collaboratively.
However, I think in any project anybody can be a director as long as they have a story to tell that is sincere and close to their heart. That’s why I chose to direct my personal projects. The best person to tell my story would be me.
One of your recent projects is the music video «Fall» for Ben&Ben. How did you get the opportunity to take part in creating the clip for a famous Filipino band?
The director of this project is my friend. He recommended me and they chose to hire me because of my narrative background. Honestly, I think we got this project because the band found out that we prefer to do things differently than others. They just liked our unique style, especially in visual storytelling.
Did you get a chance to work more with Ben&Benafter that?
Actually I worked with them for five more projects after filming «Fall». I really like their music, it’s in touch with every Filipino. They are a really mellow band and each of them is so nice and friendly. They are very open to work with new people.
Coming back to the beginning of your creative career, how did you start working with photography?
When I was in college, I enjoyed taking photographs. One day an old friend of mine who was studying filmmaking took me to work on his project. That was the moment when it all started. Right after graduation I had some weird jobs in the creative field. I even dreamed of becoming a fashion photographer. But I wasn’t so rigid with my career. Luckily, some time later I found a mentor who took me under his wing. He taught me everything I know and thanks to his mentorship I slowly went up the ranks until I could shoot my own projects as a cinematographer.
Captions from Ben&Ben — Fall
And have you studied photography anywhere?
Actually, no. In college I was studying multimedia arts which gave me the basic foundation for visual arts. That was also the same time when my love for photography began.
But why photography? What attracts you in this art?
When I started, I just really liked capturing moments but in time I’ve discovered that I can bring emotions into the visual world. Now it’s not just taking photos anymore. It’s how I build an image that could portray emotions. As a cinematographer, for example when working on the music video, I would listen to the song and then try to interpret the lyrics, the melody into a strong visual language. That’s the fun part of being a director of photography. And the best part of all this, for me, is the opportunity to work with friends on interesting things. It can feel like playing because of the atmosphere on set. Like you have the liberty liberated to create something new.
Would you like to become a film director?
Currently, I’m enjoying being a director of photography so being a video director is still pretty far from me. I think being a director of photography is also kind of a meditation for me because it doesn’t bring so much stress. And, honestly, I don’t like talking to so many people as a film director has to do every time. I’m focused only on my frames and pictures when I’m working. And I want to be the best with what I’m doing right now.
What type of photography attracts you today?
Something that brings a mood that you can feel. I really like photography that tells stories. If to name one type of photography that attracts me, it would be not perfect photography. The most beautiful photographs are those that have imperfections. Like it is in life. I’ve seen so many photos that were too technically perfect but at the same time boring. Perfect pictures are not unique for me. I can’t find spice in them. Every time I see a photo of an event or a person, I look for the eye of its photographer. I really appreciate this detail.
Ian Guevara filming
Then what is your eye as a photographer?
It’s a really difficult question to answer but I think my style is making a viewer feel something when watching my work. Maybe my photograph or video will be shot not 100% properly, will have some imperfections but that’s what I strive to do. I try to look at things in different perspectives and enhance what makes these things special. My aim is to take a mood out of it.
Are you working on new projects now?
Right now I’m working on my personal project which is about dreams. I’m documenting and interviewing some people to find out what their dreams are, what they are doing to achieve these dreams and if they are happy with their life.
Would you like to work in big feature films as a cinematographer?
Incidentally, the projects that are coming my way now are short films but each with rich stories to tell. I’ve been gravitating towards these stories that I — in some way — relate to and am given a chance to explore how to visually narrate them. Not that I don’t want to be involved in a feature film — I’m waiting for a script that I can connect with on a personal level.
How many personal projects have you already created?
I did lots of personal things when I just graduated from the school. But after that, I think, I was too focused on my career and chose not to do personal projects. But now I feel that I want to tell my stories again, I want to see what I’m able to do now with all my skills and opportunities.
Ian Guevara filming
Do you have a constant team that works with you on all projects?
I have the team but now I’m trying to make it a bit smaller so that it would be a group of people with the same vision and understanding of projects that I have.
Do you need to hire an operator for projects or you can do everything by yourself?
When I started as a director of photography, I would like always to operate my cameras but now projects are getting bigger and because of the pandemic shoot times got shorter so everything is in a rush and it’s hard to do all stuff on your own. I would prefer to get an operator for highly technical shots so I can see the bigger picture. But there are some projects wherein it’s so personal to me that I still want to operate 100% of it.
How did the covid change your working process?
Well, previously in the Philippines we could shoot 18-24 hours and sometimes even days nonstop. But now we are required to shoot only 12-14 hours, which gives us a very strict cut off. We are used to be slow pace in terms of shooting but now we are forced to do that really fast and be very focused. For sure everyone in the hierarchy of our filming process became more productive. There are less people but everyone is working 100%. You won’t see anyone sleeping on set anymore. And the quality, definitely, has become better. And I hope we retain the habits we learned from this situation even after it all ends.
Where do you find inspiration for your creativity?
I think it came with what my mentor told me: life should always be your inspiration. How would you know how good the sunset looks on set if you haven’t seen a good sunset. I think aside from watching movies, I really like observing everything around me. Ever since I was a kid, I would observe people and nature. So basically my inspiration for the projects would always be life itself.
Ian Guevara filming
How do you deal with creative crisis?
I often get that especially when I shoot nonstop. After a long shooting I just try to step away and do different things. When you loose your love or your passion, it’s really hard to find it back. But I already knew that’s gonna happen even before I became a cinematographer so I made sure that I would always do photography as a hobby. Thus when I get burned out with cinematography, I have something to do. I just pick my camera and take photos of my cats or everything that’s around me and surely enough it slowly goes back.
As we understood, you have quite a successful career in the Philippines. Isn’t that enough for you? Why have you decided to take part in various film festivals?
I’m sure that my projects are good enough to be shown somewhere else. I want to show people how the Philippines are doing their work. We live in our own “bubble” and we send only a few projects abroad. You don’t know many filipino cinematographers working in other countries, right? And that’s what I’m talking about. I won’t say that I’m gonna change it but at least I want to push myself and see what new level I can reach.
How would you describe filipino cinematography?
When I started, everyone wanted to shoot glossy, very high key, smooth lighting on faces. But right now we are in a transition where we shoot more darker scenes, more shadows although everyone started doing this years ago. We are trying to catch up, I guess. Every filipino cinematographer has a unique style. We are trying to be as brave as we can. Mostly cinematography tends to look natural but this year we are getting more and more fictional projects. And of course sometimes budgets don’t allow to create something we want.
Do you agree that every cinematographer should be good at editing and color correction?
If you know all these things, it really helps but it’s not necessary. Cinematographers are storytellers so they should know how to work with shots, color grade. Di ako sure sa gusto mo sabihin dito. Na ang director nalang ba ang dapat magbabysit ng project ba?
Ian Guevara on sat
In your opinion, are there enough opportunities today for beginners to make their career?
When I started, it was really hard to get in. I was lucky enough to apprentice under someone already inside the industry. He guided me and at the same time introduced me to a lot of filmmakers even before I became a cinematographer in my own right. It was a slow process for me to become one. But in every generation everything becomes faster. Today’s young cinematographers have been popping up and they don’t even need to climb up the ranks anymore. It’s easier now to show your talent. But at the same time harder to get solid foundation.
What platforms do you use for personal promotion?
I’m not very used to Instagram like young people now. But I’m lucky enough to be discovered in Instagram because of my work and I got sponsorships because of that. It gave me a boost in confidence that I should just continue doing my work. Today the most helpful platforms for me are Vimeo and Instagram.
What disadvantages do you find in your job?
Sometimes there can be a lack of communication with the team, especially in advertising projects. They are so fast and it’s hard for me just to let it go after finishing my work. When I am creating a project, I care about it but in commercials it shouldn’t be so. Sometimes I look at the final result and realize that it looks so differently than I intended it to be. That’s always heartbreaking for me.
And then what do you like about it?
I like creating itself. I think it’s a blessing to create what you love and get paid for it. Especially nowadays when it is so hard to get a job that you really want. And cinematography gives me everything I love: photography, storytelling and collaborating with friends.
FAVOURITE DIRECTOR
Lee Scott, Gaspar Noé, Christopher Doyle, Bradford Young
Euan Foulis is a screenwriter and director based in Edinburgh, Scotland. He has created «First Time» as an experiment in telling a story on a solely visual level. And apparently, the experiment was a success. We talked to Euan and found out what cinema means to him, what future is waiting for the Scottish filmmaking, and why filmmakers shouldn’t rely on easy ways of telling their stories.
Euan Foulis
Tell us more about the idea of creating this film. How did it come to your mind and what was your inspiration?
It came to my mind during the second lockdown here in the UK. I started to get crazy a little bit because we were stuck in that. I was watching a lot of dark movies and suddenly got the idea of making something stylistically similar. That was not really a genre I’ve experimented with before. I started thinking about what if for a character committing a murder is not only a crime but something good for him, as a positive choice. I decided to try and do it without dialogue. That was an experiment for me and my first personal serious project. And in terms of color and tone, it was definitely inspired by David Fincher’s films.
Captions from «First Time»
What emotion did you want to evoke in the audience with your film?
I wanted the audience to feel a sense of uncomfortable empathy for the main character. This story is about a personal journey that’s good for the character but it happens through committing a very violent act. And it’s obvious that she committed something that everyone knows to be wrong. But at the same time, you feel sorry for her, you start unconsciously understand her and empathize. And this situation makes you feel quite uncomfortable actually.
Where did you find actors for your film?
The main actress – Nicola Docherty – is phenomenal. Actually, she got in touch with me on Facebook. I saw this necessary passion and fire in her and understood she could be perfect for this character so I reached out to her. We talked and I found out that we were both thinking in similar directions. And about the actor who plays her boyfriend, Gareth Alexander, he also got in touch with me. Although I didn’t have a big budget for my film, he was very gracious and very kind and agreed to take part in this project. And they worked really well together.
And how long did the film production last?
It took us around two months from pre-production to filming and then three months of editing. Most of the crew worked freelance, had their schedules and I had to find time for all of them. We were all so passionate about this project and wanted to make it right so there wasn’t any hurry. We had tried so many variants to make sure it was the best possible way it could be.
In 2020 you founded Munro Productions which just completed its first short film – First Time. It is very interesting. Can you tell more details of the story of your production company?
Munro Productions is a bit of a personal thing. My family in Scotland is part of the Munro clan and I’m proud of my heritage. So I set this up as Munro Productions just as a tribute to my family and history. I set the company up right after my university graduation because I wanted a label to release my own projects under. Every film I make is a very personal endeavor for me so I felt the need to release them by myself. I wanted to make a very identifiable to me label. My plans for this company are so: I want to continue releasing my shorts. I’m leading it by myself but consequently, I’m making a pretty fairly consistent team of collaborators.
The onset photos of shooting «First Time»
Would you like to join any Scottish film production companies for work?
I actually checked some production companies but I think that, unfortunately, you need to have the level of professional connections from established names to have success as a creator in the film industry. So time will show. Besides, I want to keep making these short independent films under my own production company and see where it goes from there.
Do you have any other experience of being a director except making this short film?
I used to be an actor and tried directing at a youth theater. Yes, I used to be an actor before I realized how terrible I am at it. Anyway, there under the guidance of professionals, we put on shows that were on the main theater stage. It was always very enjoyable and collaborative. We worked together and did lots of playing exercises. It was a very creative environment that gave me opportunities to collaborate some ideas with my fellows. Spending time there was a big inspiration for me and I still try to keep that collaborative atmosphere everywhere I work.
Why and how did you decide to become a film director?
Once I got a chance to direct one scene of Shakespeare’s Macbeth. With one of my fellows in a group, we did it and people quite liked it. It was amazing to see it being performed. It was sort of the light bulb moment, I realized I love doing this. So I started to think about going into directing more. Later on that year I was in the cinema and saw Damien Chazelle’s Whiplash. I liked it so much. It’s such a visceral exciting gripping work of cinema that utterly captivated me from the first frame to the last. He took a story and did it with such passion, such flair, and such intelligence that you can enjoy it and it stays with you. And then I thought that these are the stories I want to tell, those different viewpoints I want to show. I understood that I really want to make films. The following year I signed up for a film course at the independent cinema. Two years later I got accepted to do a film production degree. And that’s the story of how I’ve been stuck in this.
In 2020 you graduated First Class from The University for the Creative Arts. Can you tell more about this course and how has studying influenced your vision?
It was a three-year course and lasted from 2017 to 2020. It’s very interesting because, honestly, it’s very different from how I expected it to be. My main expectation was that it would be very collaborative like my theater experience. But in reality, it was far more streamlined, far more organized for everyone in their departments. When I came there, I hadn’t decided what kind of a filmmaker I wanted to be. And the university gave me an idea of what films I want to create and where I want to work. And on top of that, the thing that it gave me was actual working knowledge of cinema although the studying was a very rough learning experience. And that was something I didn’t have beforehand. This basic film education is something I definitely wouldn’t have been able to make this film without.
The onset photos of shooting «First Time»
What difficulties do you meet during the filming process?
I think that you have got to be a good communicator if you are going to create something and that’s what I’m still learning. By communication I mean not only writing messages to your colleagues and checking up on them but the need to find a method of clearly communicating what your ideas are and how other people understand them. That’s not as easy as it may seem to be and not all directors are really good at communicating.
Why does telling a story on a solely visual level interest you so much?
It’s very easy to rely on dialogue when telling a story. When I was starting out with this, I wanted to push myself to treat the film as a visual medium. I try to tell a story through a selection of shots and details in the actual performance without relying on dialogue. This was really a challenge for me. The more I work on my creative stuff, the more I become sure that as a filmmaker I need to become less reliant on dialogue.
Would you like to work in Scottish filmmaking as a native or to move to Hollywood, for example?
The Scottish film industry is a bit complicated. I think in many ways Scotland, at least on the international side of things, is still recovering from Braveheart and Trainspotting. There have always been two versions of films made about Scotland, not necessarily by Scotland but about it: the proud patriotic Scottish warrior fighting for independence or its depictions of Scotland as a horrible drug-infested place, quite dark and gritty. I don’t think that Scotland has that strong a homegrown film industry like the British one, for example. A lot of people in the Scottish film industry are financing their own independent feature and short films and trying to work things out of there.
However, I do think that’s going to change in the next few years because now creators here can work outside of the mainstream British system. I reckon as the political situation here in Scotland changes and there is more of an effort to make Scotland self-sufficient, there will be a greater increase in cinema. We’ve actually seen a good example of this recently in the film Schemers that was shot in my home city. It was filmed independently and it’s been distributed for streaming services. And that’s a good model to use and I’m sure that this is the chance for Scotland to get a bit of renaissance in the future. There’s so much talent up in Scotland that only needs to get a necessary infrastructure to allow them to tell these stories.
Whether I want to do that? Well, it’s a bit tricky. I’m still deciding because the thing is that all my hopes are just my theory but I recognize that it might not happen. I mean there are lots of people in this industry who have spent years and they still have not had any success. Now I’m only at the start of my career so I don’t know whether I want to try and stick around and see if the Scottish independent film industry booms or if I want to move abroad.
In your opinion, are there enough opportunities today for young creators to put their ideas in life?
The big starting issue is budget. That’s the thing that’s holding a lot of young people back especially now when we are in the middle of the goddamn global pandemic. But there are a lot of funds here. Some are specifically dedicated to LGBT groups, to people from poor economic backgrounds. And I think that’s helping quite a lot to equalize things. As a young filmmaker, I understand that I first need to make a successful festival portfolio of work and then see if I can get myself an agent. Looking at a lot of production companies, they don’t take unsolicited scripts or ideas. So now I’m working on getting a successful portfolio together. I think the general rule is persistence: keep making your work and then try to make sure that people who are already established and successful in the industry can notice it.
In your opinion, does a film always need to be filled with serious problems and ideas?
I think it can be just fun and beautiful. Films don’t need to be serious or dark and gritty. The main thing about cinema is that there’s no concrete way to tell a story and what story should be told. I love films that are “a mood” which just let you spend time enjoying someone’s life.
Euan Foulis
Are there any film festivals organized in Edinburg or other towns in Scotland where you can take part?
The biggest ones are Edinburgh and Glasgow film festivals and they accept shorts and independent films. They get quite a high attendance every year and that’s where big names of the Scottish film industry also attend. Besides, there are some lower-budget festivals that can be a very good ground for networking and interacting with other people. In addition, it’s important to say that there are various film networking events for people who can meet up and collaborate.
What attracts you in the film industry?
For me, it just comes down to wanting to tell stories. I don’t really like the attention that comes from it and I’m not one of those who would like to be in front of the camera. Just telling stories that people will enjoy – that’s what attracts me in cinematography.
What are your plans for the near future?
I do think about going and doing a master’s at maybe one more famous UK film school or maybe even USA one. But for me, the best experience is just going out and making films, that’s how you really learn. And that’s what I’m going to do.
FAVOURITE DIRECTOR
ken loach, Andrei tarkovsky, Lynne Ramsay
FAVOURITE MUSIC
modern orchestral stuff
DREAM MOVIE YOU WOULD LIKE TO FILM
Roman swords and sandals drama with the aesthetic of a Vietnam war
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